The Blacklist Refugees » The Suitcase

lara1 · 2/06/2018 2:32 pm

Eastcoast #280. Hi! yes, all of what you say is certainly possible. But yes, the Mercedes would have to have a custom fitted cassette deck as those were well phased out for CDs.

But I guess my point is, I don't think there are even many audio cassettes manufactured now, though they still are, a lot of it has gone digital to download on phones and other devices. I think they made that point as well as the others they have done (Star Wars, projectors, stereo equipment from the seventies etc) to set up Red as of a certain era of course, and maybe he does cling to old ways. But I think that the audio cassette, and the 2001 book, were mentioned for a specific reason....LOL

I think the movie projector is, for me, more about the age of the film rather than Red using a projector. Yes, people still had and took movies on 8mm into the eighties, but then why not just show home movies on equipment from that era (which would still be out of date today) so that we could peg a date range for reference......

Or maybe that's what they want us to think. LOL. Its certainly possible that its just to have Red appear as clinging to certain old technology and nothing more......

Tuxie400 · 2/06/2018 2:38 pm

I have found online verification of one of the things I have believed since CODIS was linked to our suitcase body. Cold Cases from 1990 and earlier with usable DNA can be entered into CODIS by the local law enforcement agency investigating the case. See the article below that features two older cases, one from 1990 and other from 1981, that were solved when DNA was entered later into the federal data base. (The 1990 case is particularly interesting and involves a transgender serial killer.)

https://www.forensicscolleges.com/blog/resources/10-cold-cases-solved

From my understanding, two law enforcement parties would be notified of a hit: The law enforcement officer placing the request and the law enforcement officer/agency that placed the DNA from the match. So from a real-world standpoint, only two potential people would have been notified: Pete masquerading as Liz Keen and Garvey, if he's the local law enforcement who originally placed the DNA that was matched.

2/06/2018 2:57 pm

Ooo, good find Tuxie. I had been looking around online to see if there was information about that too but could never find it. I wondered if DNA profiles already gathered prior to 1990 were automatically entered when CODIS came into creation or if they are just entered on an individual basis as needed when reexamining a crime. Or perhaps it's a jurisdiction by jurisdiction thing.

lara1 · 2/06/2018 3:28 pm

Thanks Tuxie400 good find. I guess there is a third possibility (there always is with me LOL), only in TBL land, that someone in gov is monitoring whatever Liz does (like Cooper did in the beginning and they knew she had run the ballistics tests). Remember that I noted that Tom's "DNA REPORT" and labelling looked almost identical to Liz's "ballistics report" and labelling back in Season 1. There was a trigger that alerted Ressler/Cooper that she had placed a request for that report, which had been redacted anyway.

Since we saw a parallel to that already, I wonder if there is another parallel to the Liz "monitoring" part.
Of course this could just as well not be the case. In that event it would be the local jurisdiction only.

How that would tie in Garvey, or whoever he is working for if anyone (we had the "eyeball" and the sophisticated computer equipment in the abandoned location last week) is still a mystery

Last edited by lara1 (2/06/2018 3:29 pm)

2/06/2018 3:36 pm

That's a good point, Lara, about someone monitoring Liz's actions. I would have thought that with an FBI agent being attacked in her own home that the FBI would have done it's own internal investigation to see if something related to her job had been involved and they would have looked into anything she had done in the fairly recent past leading up to it. Since Liz was never alerted directly that her ID was used and no one has ever mentioned it I have wondered if Garvey had the power to intervene with the search and keep it from getting back to her, especially if he had the file flagged or put on some sort of odd security clearance.

Edit: So I went back to watch the last parts with living Pete and he didn't say anything about actually knowing the results, just that he ran the search. I wonder if the results that came back weren't able to be read because they were above Liz's security clearance. Perhaps Pete and Nik neither one knew anything but were killed just because they knew about the bones?

Last edited by Brittany (2/06/2018 3:44 pm)

lara1 · 2/06/2018 4:39 pm

Hmmm. So Pete didn’t know. I wonder if they were on Pete’s computer screen when Nik looked at it.

Someone somewhere was able to track that request back to Pete’s computer. Someone with the means to reverse engineer it back from Codis, not just be aware of it. Hmmm

We are closer but nowhere again! Lol

lara1 · 2/06/2018 4:40 pm

Oh but who had the envelope? I don’t remember if that was in pete’s Apt or if he had it in the motel. Lol

2/06/2018 7:40 pm

I only remember seeing Garvey with the envelope in that barn. I don’t recall Pete having it.

Tuxie400 · 2/06/2018 8:01 pm

Garvey was the one with the envelope.I think those were his results. I don't think Pete had time to print anything out before he was attacked.

lara1 · 2/06/2018 8:10 pm

Tuxie400 wrote:
Garvey was the one with the envelope.I think those were his results. I don't think Pete had time to print anything out before he was attacked.

interesting. I don't think I realized that. unless Pete had put them in the suitcase, so it was in there when mystery man took the suitcase. But Pete never said he had them.....

Eastcoast · 2/07/2018 1:41 am

Yes Tuxie, Garvey is the one who had them, I remember that. He put them in the suitcase when he came in the barn if I remember correctly. And your post 283, yes they can put old Dna in there. There have been several old cases where they have put it in the Codis and are waiting.

#286, I was wondering that too. Why isn't the task force all over this? It should be a priority!
This whole thing is just very weird the way it is being handled!

lara1 · 2/07/2018 1:59 am

Good points both. I think Red is biding his time and may even know who it was. But the task force - it’s odd considering one of their own was attacked in her own home. You would think it a priority. It is odd. Food for conspiracy theories too ! 😀

Last edited by lara1 (2/07/2018 1:59 am)

Eastcoast · 2/07/2018 2:05 am

I agree. Conspiracy is almost an understatement.

We havent heard one person on the task force talk about having a case about working to find them.

The closest thing I can think of is samar saying she would send a unit in the last episode.

lara1 · 2/20/2018 7:00 pm

So here's an interesting theory. I dipped into Reddit today and saw a theory I hadn't seen before on the bones. someone posted they could be the real Carla Reddington. That's an interesting idea. But I'm trying to figure out why that would be and why it would break apart Liz and Red. Unless the real Carla Reddington was Liz's real mother....but that makes no sense because Red has called Liz "Masha" when speaking with Dom. Unless Liz was switched for Masha and not even Dom knows. But that makes even MY head hurt, LOL

Just wondered if anyone else had any ideas on the bones being Carla. And more importantly, why would someone swap with her. It may just be an interesting and neat idea that doesn't stand up to further scrutiny but I like to think about it.....

2/20/2018 7:17 pm

I can’t imagine any reasonably realistic scenario in which that would make sense. I can’t believe for a second that Carla is Katarina in disguise.

Theories I have tossed around outside of my belief that it is either KR or evidence of a faked KR death (because I do try to consider alternatives) include:

1) Jennifer, though it gets problematic because I can’t see Red killing her or keeping that info from Carla and pretending to be concerned about her safety in season 2.

2) Jane Doe child/teenager Red used to fake Liz’s death to KR at some point. Problematic because Tom recognized the name on the report enough to feel he had answers (unless we get into an Alchemist type situation but I I think that’s a stretch), and the bones look too big for a young child (and I think Nik and Pete would have pointed that out if they thought the person was really young).

3) Someone Liz killed on the night of the fire that would have made her a huge target if people found out. This gets a little hazy even in BL universe because why would anyone pursue killing a woman that killed someone accidentally as a child, but it also doesn’t make sense why people would still want to get Liz because of KR who they believe is dead. So I guess it isn’t completely impossible.

4) someone big Red has killed that Liz may not know and we the audience may not know but that Tom would know of from his time as an operative. I still think this is possible though how it would connect to KR I don’t know.

lara1 · 2/20/2018 7:43 pm

Interesting thoughts Brittany.

Oh, I don't think the Carla we saw is KR, I did not get that vibe at all. But I do think she is of the spy world as I do think the chicken bone thing connects her to Berlin in some way even if only symbolic.

But I don't know who would be current Carla, unless it was someone from fire night who also needed to disappear. I wonder sometimes if they all disappeared in one way or another. KR, Red, whoever was shot, little Liz given a new identity with Sam, maybe they all scattered when something very big went wrong. So the Carla we see could be the woman with the dark hair we see in the fire memories. There is a woman's voice who does say, Are you crazy? and we hear Carla say to Red, you're even crazier than I thought, or something like that. in the fire memories we don't see a red-haired woman, which of course doesn't mean she wasn't there, she could have turned up later or her identity obscured from Liz.

Anyway getting back to the suitcase, the Carla thing would tie into Garvey because he might recognize it and then know that the woman known as "Carla/Naomi" is no such person. May be another reason why Red wanted to get her out of Witsec and under his own protection. Maybe.

It would be a name that Tom would recognize. But where it falls apart I think is why that would drive Red and Liz apart. Unless the bones are the real Carla and the real Carla was her mother. But again that doesn't stand up to analysis. LOL

Last edited by lara1 (2/20/2018 7:44 pm)

2/20/2018 8:13 pm

Lara- I have wondered if Carla was around when Red took Liz. What if he confessed his affair to her and about Liz and the Fulcrum because he knew he needed to take Liz from KR to protect her and was concerned about a target on himself? Carla, concerned about hers and Jennifer’s safety (and possibly desperate to keep her family together) agrees to help Red with Liz until they can figure out the next move.

But I agree that i cant figure out a way a Carla in the suitcase would hurt Liz’s relationship with Red. We see Liz with Kaplan and KR and I don’t think Kaplan would devote her life to a child that wasn’t Liz/Masha.

Last edited by Brittany (2/20/2018 8:14 pm)

lara1 · 2/20/2018 8:18 pm

So Brittany , just to play devil's advocate, I will submit that the Liz we saw in the fire memories does not look like the Liz in the hotel room because Liz in the fire memory has longer, wavy hair and is, conceivably, a bit older. that could be of course because they needed an actress a little bit older to pull off the role....but I remember reading somewhere that the child actress wore a wig. I don't get why it would be wavy when the swing photo doesn't show that (nor does the photo that Kirk has, or, again, little Liz in the hotel room with Kate). We know there was another girl with wavy hair. But LOL what is it with this show and hair? hahaha

Last edited by lara1 (2/20/2018 8:19 pm)

2/20/2018 8:28 pm

I can’t get the hair thing. Those scenes were two seasons apart with different children. Liz remembers the fire (albeit distortedly)) and KR knows her own kid. They could have very well changed their mind about what they wanted her hair to look like at the time, didn’t think about the wig, etc. plus 99.9% of watchers don’t remember/ care about the difference in hair.

Last edited by Brittany (2/20/2018 8:28 pm)

Tuxie400 · 2/20/2018 11:06 pm

I think the only way those bones would be Carla's would be if she was accidentally killed on Fire Night, and Katarina went into Protective Custody in Carla's place. So there's another imposter theory for you. But that doesn't explain what she would be doing with Jennifer - if Jennifer is Carla's child. At this point, I don't embrace the idea that Naomi/Carla is Katarina. But if she were, at least she wouldn't be Red.