The Blacklist Refugees » The Suitcase

lara1 · 2/02/2018 4:46 pm

Hi all, I have caught up with the episode and will catch up with comments.

I don't have many further ideas about the suitcase but a few thoughts.

I don't think the address tag means anything, as some of us discussed already, because basically the suitcase was thrown out once the bones were moved to the duffel bag. (I did think it interesting when they were because the "black bag" Red carries around featured prominently in the Liz wedding shoot up and in Cape May. )

However, I did find it interesting that Liz's words to Red in their discussion were very similar to what she told him, when she rejected him, after learning from the fire memories he was at fire night and she thought he was only interested in her to find the fulcrum. It wasn't quite the same, but the parallel is that she thinks he has his own self interest in mind when helping to find the suitcase. I therefore wonder if it is, as some have mentioned, his own fulcrum. A real one, this time, meaning he has it. Whatever the secret is

Also, REd's reason for not telling Liz sounds to me a bit like when he refused to tell her who her father was. He knew who it was, but refused to tell her. His main reason being that it would put her in danger. (Whatever happened to that unless Red is not real her father so she's technically not in real danger, but I digress LOL)

I'm starting to wonder whether the "truth" that Dembe speaks of to Red is different from the suitcase. People are willing to kill for the bones, Garvey may be working for a very big bad with sophisticated technology. Even Red's whiz kid couldn't figure it out right away.....maybe Tom thought he knew everything but didn't, including why the "truth" could harm Liz.

Just kicking around ideas....but the parallel to the "I know but can't tell you who your father is" parallel stood out to me for some reason......

Tuxie400 · 2/02/2018 7:40 pm

lara1 - I'm glad you finally had time to watch the episode. I also thought Liz's words to Red had a similar feel to those from after Dr. Orchard's memory regression.

What did you think of all the Star Wars references?

Honey West · 2/02/2018 7:59 pm

lara1, I also think the suitcase is not the Big Secret, it's A big secret, but not THE big one. We've been told we'd find out whose bones those are by the end of the season. JS says he thinks the show could go on for two more seasons at least. Going by that, I am thinking the suitcase is just another piece of that big jigsaw puzzle that was tossed up into the air.

lara1 · 2/02/2018 8:33 pm

Honey West wrote:
lara1, I also think the suitcase is not the Big Secret, it's A big secret, but not THE big one. We've been told we'd find out whose bones those are by the end of the season. JS says he thinks the show could go on for two more seasons at least. Going by that, I am thinking the suitcase is just another piece of that big jigsaw puzzle that was tossed up into the air.

HoneyWest - that is interesting. I am still digging out from a crazy week so I haven't caught up with all the postings, reviews, interviews etc.

I tended to think when Dembe kind of scolded Red in the car about still lying to Liz and Tom, even "after everything that has happened", it meant something other than the secret in the suitcase. Like, Liz faked her death to get away from him, he (Red) has put his life on the line for her several tines, the whole Kaplan devastation - even after all of that, Red can't tell Liz the "truth". It really makes me wonder what the truth is, especially Red's reaction in another ep where he just says to Dembe, "I don't know" ....why I can't tell her. I do have one theory but probably not for this board.

Anyways, getting back to James' comment, it seems they have a lot of storytelling yet to do (yay). In that context yeah, the bones are a big secret (probably as being important to Red) but not THE secret.

lara1 · 2/02/2018 8:41 pm

Tuxie400 wrote:
lara1 - I'm glad you finally had time to watch the episode. I also thought Liz's words to Red had a similar feel to those from after Dr. Orchard's memory regression.

What did you think of all the Star Wars references?

Tuxie400 - Star Wars, LOL. I was grinning ear to ear when Red had absolutely no idea what Liz and then the whiz kid was talking about. Because I had no idea either! I have not followed Star Wars at all. I saw the first film when it came out, but never another one. Space travel and science fiction are just not my thing - Have no interest whatsoever in it. So I had to google the Jedi mind trick or whatever it was. (LOL sounds like one of our favorite characters!!!)

I did think it odd that they dropped all of those Star Wars references in the space of a short time in one episode. I have to re-watch the ep. But Liz did make a Jedi reference to Red, and the Jedi were the good guys. Broadly speaking, there's the good guys and then the bad guys battling it out in that saga. The Jedi attend a sort of academy training to develop and perfect their skills, including the Jedi Mind whatever it was called. Which ties into the good/evil theme of the show. And sometimes good is evil and vice versa. but other than that waffling on, I hadn't thought it through yet.

But did you notice that when Red looked at the poster in the kid's basement, (didn't Red tell a story once about eating bologna sandwiches in his friend's basement or something (hmmm)), he mentioned how the GREEN fellow was far too short to be successful in a sword battle?

Had you any thoughts?

Tuxie400 · 2/02/2018 9:22 pm

lara1 - I was not a big Star Wars fan either, but I knew enough to connect with all the references. I knew the green guy was Yoda, and the "bear" was the Wookie. I did look up Darth Vader though, since I never watched the prequels. and, if there's any parallel with Star Wars it would be Red and Darth Vader.. Darth Vader started out as good guy Anakin Skywalker, but turned to the dark side to protect his secret wife and his unborn child.

lara1 · 2/02/2018 9:30 pm

Tuxie400 - that is interesting about Darth Vader. And wasn't there some chatter at the time of Kirk's initial confrontation with Liz that his words were like Darth Vader to ... is it Luke Skywalker? (LOL I'm sorry but I really never had interest in those films).

Secret wife, secret child. Wujing, the secret child. Well as you know I think there is/was another child, the ghost in the fire house closet, so I like that connection.

Tuxie400 · 2/02/2018 9:38 pm

There's been a running joke on tumblr for years with photo of Vader saying, Lizzie, I am your father. And Kirk's "Masha, I am your father" was a take off on Vader and Luke. Luke and Princess Leia were twins, and their mother, Padme, had been a princess, queen, and a senator.

Eastcoast · 2/03/2018 1:33 pm

I had not heard the Vader joke. Lol,

lara1 · 2/03/2018 7:56 pm

Tuxie400 - there's a discussion on Reddit about the Star Wars thing. No answers but some interesting thoughts. Chief of which is, how could Red not know about Star Wars, which was a cultural phenomenon. Yeah, I didn't know the details of what was being talked about but I had heard of Star Wars, the concept of Jedi and may the force be with you. Red seems perplexed. The initial movie came out in 1977,when Red would have been 17 and entering the Naval Academy. I have a thought I'm turning over in my head. But I want to re-watch the episode first and see exactly what is said again......

Of course it may just be a joke where Red doesn't know anything about it. But unlike "blmueteeth" (which he recognized as a term) or "face whatever" (again he recognized as a thing), Star Wars was hugely culturally pervasive.

Tuxie400 · 2/03/2018 8:03 pm

It does seem weird Red wouldn't have known a few things about Star Wars, even if he never saw the movie.

lara1 · 2/03/2018 8:11 pm

Tuxie400 - the more I think about the odder it seems. Red has extensive knowledge of just about everything...he doesn't understand computers and technology but he knows the references and the need to stay offline and analog when required. He can relay a story about the most obscure things (the hideous fish for example, the original of the cul de sac) but is oblivious to Star Wars?

2/03/2018 8:22 pm

I honestly found it odder than he didn't know 4 was an unlucky number to the Japanese than not knowing Star Wars. I know pretty much nothing about Star Wars, but I do know 4 is unlucky in Japan. And as much as Red travels and the really obscure stuff he knows from other cultures, I would have thought he would have known that.

Tuxie400 · 2/03/2018 8:34 pm

Brittany - Yes, with all Red's worldwide business dealings, he should have known about 4 being unlucky in Japanese culture. I understand hotels there don't even label the fourth floor with a four. They just skip the number.

2/03/2018 8:44 pm

Tuxie- I spent two weeks in Japan in high school as part of an exchange and I remember someone walking me through steps of something and while there were only 4 steps, they kept holding up 5 fingers.

Honey West · 2/04/2018 2:00 pm

I also found his ignorance about the number four to be odd because he seems to know so much about all of those little sorts of things. Maybe they thought it would be a funny way for him to insult Mom accidentally, but so many of us "regular" people know that significance that it seems that someone in the writers room would have flagged that. Years ago I took a pottery class from a Japanese teacher who insisted that I not make sets of four of anything, it was bad luck.

But I would have figured that Red had at least some familiarity with Star Wars. It’s kind of odd what he knows and doesn’t know sometimes. It’s like they’re trying to tell us he’s from another time or something. Maybe he’s really Austin Powers?

2/04/2018 2:58 pm

I figure the Star Wars stuff was just for a laugh (exaggerating his Luddite-ness). But his ignorance of the number 4 seemed like something the writers should have known.

lara1 · 2/04/2018 3:43 pm

I'm not sure the number 4 is more well known than Star Wars. Even my Mom at 85 knew "may the force be with you" and she never saw a single film.

I had no idea about the number four, nor did some of my friends. But I agree its something you would expect Red to know. I do wonder whether it was just another link to Star Wars, and that's how they worked it in.

WE do have to take so much at face value in this series because a lot of it doesn't make entire sense anyway in the "real" world. Like KR, a double agent spy, keeping a journal writing about her spy stuff. And Pete being able to gain access to CODIS just by having Liz's badge number. I doubt in the real world that would be the case. Even private companies have several levels of authentication needed to get to a computer housed in an organization, accessed remotely through someone's laptop. But to me it doesn't matter. There is so much on so many shows that isn't real. If you picked out on everything you could not watch nor enjoy any show! LOL

Eastcoast · 2/06/2018 12:57 pm

About Star Wars,

Lara1, my mom is in her late 70's and couldn't tell you one thing about Star Wars! Lol.

Cassettes & 8mm,

I personally found when it comes to tv or music people stick to what they like for the most part.
I have a large Vinyl collection because it is what I prefer in sound. I have a few friends who have cassette players in their car along with cd players because they had large collections and only get the new music they like on cd. ( I do too )

The spy book he and Miles spoke of was a movie in the mid 60's and I believe was was on audio books if I'm not mistaken.

I also know people who have the old projectors. They have old hone movies they don't want to Leave at a store to ne sent off and possibly get lost. I have an issue eith that now myself with film I found. I want it done on location only.

In his case, if he is in it or if by some long shot that is KR or Naomi then he wouldn't want any of them to be seen!
Not saying he couldn't have someone do it, but he may not want to take that chance.
Just a thought..

Eastcoast · 2/06/2018 1:04 pm

The other thing I keep meaning to mention that us bugging me is if Garvey got the info on Codis, why hasn't anyone else been told? Is he the only one who caught it and was he in a position to keep anyone else from seeing it?
It is strange if it leads to Dom why Garvey hasn't contacted him by now unless he has?

Lara, post 279, Pete said it was a 3 step process.