The Blacklist Refugees » The Suitcase

11/03/2017 5:32 am

East coast #60 That thought crossed my mind yesterday while talking to mother about the show. I told her that I thought the scene at the cemetery had possibly been foreshadowing, then wondered if Agnes ended up dying. That would certainly be a bold move to kill a baby and it would definitely change everyone’s lives but it would stray Liz’s life off the path of the parallelism (unless Red had a child killed that we have not been told about yet).

. But if that were to happen, who would Liz hold responsible? Red, Tom, or herself (or what combination)?

Last edited by Brittany (11/03/2017 5:39 am)

Tuxie400 · 11/03/2017 9:27 am

Eastcoast - I had the same thought yesterday. The death or maiming of Agnes would change all their lives. And I'm sure Liz would become a lunatic vigilante. Maybe that toy falling to the floor was the biggest foreshadowing of them all. We've had so many episodes with children with disabilities. Maybe they were foreshadowing what will happen to Agnes. I'm also remembering that in The Beekeeper novel, Agnes and Tom were not around.

The last time we had this many cemetery scenes, they were foreshadowing Liz's fake death. So I think someone will die, either Tom or Agnes.

Last edited by Tuxie400 (11/03/2017 9:36 am)

JackPow · 11/03/2017 9:52 am

Brittany #59 - Excellent point. I sort of forgot about it but I think the fact that both Dembe and Kaplan use Katarina's name in direct reference to the suitcase makes it clear that the bones have personal significance to HER. (or are actually her bones) So for me now, I'm content with ruling out some daughter of Red's or any other person not highly significant to KR's interests.
While the writers are always going to play with words to keep the mystery going, I think it's a safe bet that the bones are highly relevant to KR so that helps in narrowing the possibilities.

(But of course....I'm still kinda holding on to Redarina, with the bones being the original RR. But yes, I'm fully aware of all of the conflicting evidence for that)

Last edited by JackPow (11/03/2017 9:52 am)

lara1 · 11/03/2017 6:30 pm

Eastcoast, others - the thought about Agnes briefly crossed my mind as well. I wonder if they will be bold enough to do that. It would certainly shock people, even if people have it there as a potential plot line. It does make that scene with Tom and Agnes more than a bit unsettling, IMO....and maybe that is why we have not seen her at all except for that one time (they could have cut back screen time, but there weren't even mentions of her)

Maybe that happens and what we see in the flash forward is Red attempting to kill Tom because of it - I think his moral code (Agnes perhaps gone) would allow him to do that. And maybe Liz stops him. Pure guessing

Of course that would all be a parallel to what Kaplan did with Cuba. She made a decision that ultimately put Liz and Agnes in harm's way. Now she has done the same with the suitcase - because if something does happen to Agnes as a result of her digging up that case - that's down to her. One could argue that Tom was sloppy with Cuba and did not take proper precautions to remain hidden, or that he should not have gone out on his own to investigate the case but if Kaplan had not started each of those chains in action, nothing would have happened. And in both cases, her objective - keeping Agnes safe - would have been totally negated.

I do think it would be a parallel to Red, because I believe he had a child who came into harm's way probably incidientally through something he did or didn't do (though we have not been told that definitively).

I guess we'll find out soon. But I agree the cemeteries are foreshadowing something. And tying in Meera, and the ties Tom had with her death, probably means something.....

Last edited by lara1 (11/03/2017 6:32 pm)

lara1 · 11/03/2017 6:41 pm

on the suitcase, I agree that its something to do with KR, though it doesn't mean it is her. And at the same time, important to Red. It could be "Reddington" if KR was in fact in love with him and something happened to him at the hands of Red. I was trying to find out the same info, unsuccessfully, about CODIS and whether and how older samples of DNA would be added to the index. The FBI did not have Reddington's DNA sample prior to his disappearance. Suppose though that it appeared somewhere else and was then added to CODIS - what about those New York Police Dept fingerprints for example, on file?

Who knows, LOL. Each idea has its things that cancel it out. But I agree its not a random stranger. The DNA connects that skeleton with someone and I'm betting it is Liz. Why else would Nik have had that look on his face when he looked at the computer screen?

11/03/2017 8:33 pm

Lara- I never saw any sort of odd reaction on Nik's face as he was looking at the computer. I saw him looking as though he was trying to find something, maybe squinting because he's staring at a bright light in a dark room, then being grabbed by the killer. Am I the only one who didn't see anything odd about his expression?

lara1 · 11/03/2017 8:51 pm

Brittany - to me he looked like a combination of perplexed - Like - what the heck? and surprised. But we all bring our own perceptions to how we view what's in a scene. Though I don't think they would have set up that scene to have Nik look at the computer screen if there wasn't anything "interesting" on it.....whatever that may mean! LOL But it could very well mean nothing other than Pete was researching the answers. And a distraction while sneaker man came up behind him.

Tuxie400 · 11/03/2017 10:26 pm

Brittany - I agree with lara1 about Nik's expression when he was looking at the computer screen. It looked to me like he was looking at the DNA results and saw something that surprised him.

11/04/2017 7:41 am

I went back and watched that clip a few times. I tried to see it but couldn’t find anything that said to me “shocked”. Hopefully we’ll find out if he did learn something.

11/04/2017 11:05 am

I know there was some speculation this season that Nik was working for Red because of his change of heart with helping Tom. That was eliminated by 5.05 but could Nik have been pressured by someone else to do this? What are the chances that the guy Nik knew from med school would just happen to be living a secret life and seem like some sort of operative and that everything would start building from there? Could Nik have been pressured by Oleander to dig up Pete and use him because he already worked for Oleander and the whole thing about knowing him from med school was a ruse? There’s just something about the Pete connection and everything that went down with him that has felt off and I haven’t been able to put my finger on it.

Tuxie400 · 11/04/2017 12:04 pm

Brittany - I'm wondering if Pete was really who Nik said he was. Did Nik just change his mind about helping Tom because of his lingering feelings for Liz, or was he threatened or pressured to get the bones? There are also some speculations out there that that Pete is actually Oleander. And how Mr. Crespin fits into all of this is anybody's guess.

11/04/2017 3:13 pm

Tuxie- Good point on Pete perhaps being Oleander. It just seems too convenient that Nik just happened to know Pete. Kaplan wouldn't have anticipated Tom going to Nik---she thought he would give the suitcase to Liz directly, as he had planned. But he veered off-course when Liz told him Red is her father (which may be what JB meant when he said that Kaplan not knowing that Liz would find out changes things in regards to the suitcase). I don't think Pete was put into place on the off-chance it would happen. If he were Oleander (or working for Oleander), he could have been following Tom to see what he would do, then have intervened. He may have very well threatened or pressured Nik to follow along with his story. Nik is a pretty good liar--he made Red believe Liz was dead. I have no problem believing he could have fooled Tom.

lara1 · 11/04/2017 10:20 pm

The biggest question for me right now is - whoever is after the suitcase, how did they find out about it in the first place? that to me is a huge thing.

I'm still not sure Pete killed Nik. Because whoever killed him didn't move the body. And I think Pete is the most likely candidate for who moved it. And, I tend to think that Nik disturbed whoever was in the flat - if it was Pete, why would he be hanging around for hours, days until Nik maybe showed up? Why not just call him and then attack him? Or was Nik just killed because he found out, through what was on the screen, what the answer was? LOL

I'm not sure if the guy after Pete's girlfriend is working on behalf of Pete or of the big bad. Then again I wonder if Pete is just an agent of the big bad like Tom was an agent of Berlin in Season 1. What led me to think this were all the parallels with Season 1, the scene with Pete which resembles when Tom disappeared after the Berlin arc, and that Oleander is another one-word named big bad. Should we be looking at Oleander as a place, rather than a person? (the opposite of Berlin) or is there a place called Oleander, with may provide some clues?

LOL I don't think I answered a single question, just created new ones! haha

Eastcoast · 11/05/2017 2:04 am

I'm in between on Nik's face when he was looking at that the computer. I thought he was just trying to read it. I didn't see a look of surprise so to speak. At least not until his neck was grabbed.
I do wonder about him knowing his killer? Sometimes, not all the time, a person who hired who they are because they know them and don't want to see their face.

Eastcoast · 11/05/2017 2:07 am

Lara1, I think it was because of the search that was ran or the fact that in that world news travels!
People like Albert turning up dead raises questions.

Eastcoast · 11/05/2017 2:09 am

Tuxie, #71, I totally question everything about Pete.

As soon as Nik described him I was wondering what part he was going to play in all this. (nerdy)
😴😴😴😴

Last edited by Eastcoast (11/05/2017 2:12 am)

Tuxie400 · 11/05/2017 9:39 am

lara1 wrote:
The biggest question for me right now is - whoever is after the suitcase, how did they find out about it in the first place? that to me is a huge thing.

I'm still not sure Pete killed Nik. Because whoever killed him didn't move the body. And I think Pete is the most likely candidate for who moved it. And, I tend to think that Nik disturbed whoever was in the flat - if it was Pete, why would he be hanging around for hours, days until Nik maybe showed up? Why not just call him and then attack him? Or was Nik just killed because he found out, through what was on the screen, what the answer was? LOL

I'm not sure if the guy after Pete's girlfriend is working on behalf of Pete or of the big bad. Then again I wonder if Pete is just an agent of the big bad like Tom was an agent of Berlin in Season 1. What led me to think this were all the parallels with Season 1, the scene with Pete which resembles when Tom disappeared after the Berlin arc, and that Oleander is another one-word named big bad. Should we be looking at Oleander as a place, rather than a person? (the opposite of Berlin) or is there a place called Oleander, with may provide some clues?

LOL I don't think I answered a single question, just created new ones! haha

If Pete really did work for a drug cartel, the cartel could have been monitoring Pete and found out about the suitcase that way. Or Pete's CODIS search could have alerted someone. I like your idea that Pete, like Tom, is an operative working for the Big Bad. I also had the idea that Oleander might be a place, rather than a person. But the only Oleander place that I can find is a street in Boston.

Last edited by Tuxie400 (11/05/2017 12:38 pm)

Tuxie400 · 11/05/2017 9:40 am

Eastcoast - I guess I'm more gullible. I didn't question anything Nik said about Pete in the beginning.

lara1 · 11/05/2017 12:07 pm

Tuxie400 - LOL, yes I actually had that thought about the database when the episode aired! - that the DNA search in CODIS sent off alarm bells. And I thought whoever is now after the suitcase is someone in the intelligence services. LOL too many theories! ha

On the bones, I am watching my weekly dose of Sherlock Holmes - there is a network where I am that re-runs the 1940s versions with Basil RAthbone every Sunday - nice to sit back with coffee and enjoy - anyway in today's film, they just showed a scene where Holmes and Watson open a closet to find a skeleton inside! I kid you not - anyway Watson knows immediately that despite its small size it is not a child's skeleton because it has too many teeth - children have fewer teeth than adults. Not sure if we have a good look at the teeth in the suitcase! Then again I'm not so sure TBL production would have been that precise in the details anyway. Or whomever manufactures the "fake" skeleton.

Last edited by lara1 (11/05/2017 12:08 pm)

11/05/2017 6:47 pm

I agree that I believe the CODIS search triggered something in the system to alert interested parties, but I still feel like Pete was far too convenient/shady. Perhaps one party involves Pete and there is a second (or multiple) interested party that was triggered by the CODIS search? Perhaps they came to Pete’s apartment and he had to run, they killed Nik and got the bones? I both dread the fall finale because it means no Blacklist for a while and also can’t wait for it to get here because I feel like we will get something of an answer in that episode.

Last edited by Brittany (11/05/2017 6:57 pm)