You know, I would say that Kaplan is the obvious choice, if she did not want Liz to know something either about Red or about her (Liz's) connection to Red.  This is a Kaplan arc after all.  And we've seen from Requiem that she has resented Red.  Its puzzling that the Doctor didn't seem to know her or recognize her though.  Unless it was done through a third party.

I wonder if they will let us know by the season finale!  

Tatiana - I always enjoy Eaglechica's theories. And after all, a Leonard was hiding out with Red in my basement dream. When I read Eaglechica's theory, I even thought that weird  recent scar on Red's neck might be pointing to Caul. But after thinking about it, Caul seems a weak suspect. What's his motive for keeping info about Red from Lizzie?  What could be big enough that it would stop Red and Liz from bringing down the Cabal?

lara1 - I don't think Ressler under any circumstances would have anyone's memories altered. The Boyscout personality just wouldn't go there- unless his own memories had been tampered with first.

We know from Bokenkamp that Harold has a secret he's holding, and it's a trump card. Whatever this secret is about Reddington, Liz very likely could have told Cooper.  He's her father figure. It might be Harold. But the memory tampering couldn't have happened after she shot Connolly, could it? I wouldn't think there would be enough time between when she shot Connolly and when she left with Red. I think it was more likely that the memory tampering happened prior to the Connolly shooting, and it may even be what triggered it. 

I don't think Samar or Aram can be counted out as suspects. Samar is Red's spy, his mole, his person on the inside - placed there to keep an eye on Liz.  Because of her extensive spy background., the international woman of mystery could have known of Kirlov. Aram has done sneaky stuff repeatedly to help his friends. At one time, we said all roads led to Aram.  How he would know about Krilov is beyond me, but Aram finds out lots of unexpected stuff. If this was hurting Liz emotionally, Red directly, and it would lead to the closing of the task force, Aram might do it.

Ultimately, I don't think it's figure-outable. So I'm just going to enjoy the ride.

 

Well, I promised myself to stop thinking about the memories thing, but something I read sparked my thoughts about Tom again.  And Kirk.

It depends on whether the "2 years" is meant to be 24 months or dates.  Its now 2017.  Two years ago was 2015.  Liz was outed as Masha Rostova.  She shot Connolly, went on the run with Red, tried to surrender to the Russian Embassy and all around this was on the news.

Fast forward to Season 4, many of us wondered whether Kirk had somehow planted things or otherwise contrived to trigger Liz's memories and make Liz "remember" the summer Palace.  Liz, who had no memory of her mother or her past, rather suddenly remembers her mother and the garden and the time capsule buried.  

When Kirk finds Liz he talks about how she was lost to him for over 20 years.  Then he suddenly saw her on the news as Masha Rostova. And sees her on the news on the run with Reddington.

Then we were puzzled as to why Kirk was so intent on killing Tom.  At some point, however, he stopped pursuing that strategy.  Why?

Then we saw how Kirk was surprised that Liz had somehow got the DNA test from the Soviet intelligence file on Kirk.

So my wild theory is  - suppose Kirk worked through Tom to have Krilov plant memories in Liz (maybe memories that Kirk thought  had been there, but erased, or new memories, just to make sure she would remember).

Kirk could not get hold of Liz while she was on the run with Red, but once that was over, he hired Scottie's group to abduct Liz.  The memories may have been one part of his plan, done prior to Liz going on the run.  Then Kirk had to delay executing the second part of his plan until he had a better chance of getting Liz.

So in my theory, Kirk then wants to eliminate Tom to erase the evidence of what had happened with the memory tampering.Kirk then stopped pursuing that at some point.  Was the DNA test an attempt by Tom to get Kirk off his back - ?  I guess its possible, though I can't remember exactly when Kirk called his men off Tom.  Or maybe its just that Mate met his end.

In any event, as I write this, I realize that it does play back into the "two girls/two daughters" theory.  Many of us thought that Liz must be Masha/Liz as she remembered the time capsule in the garden with her mother, and there was a real time capsule buried.  But what if the event may have really happened, but with another "daughter".  But Liz remembers it as "Masha" as that is the memory that Kirk had Krilov "restored" or planted just for insurance (Kirk not knowing that Liz is not Masha).  But in reality, it wasn't restoring a memory of Liz's - it was implanting a memory of Masha's within Liz.  

So, Liz remembered her mother in the garden as Masha even though she isn't really Masha.  I'm not saying that I'm convinced of that, I'm just throwing it out there as a theory that has possibilities.

I hope you can all follow that!  OF course its just a theory and probably off base.  But it might tie together a few loose ends.  LOL  


 

Last edited by lara1 (5/07/2017 6:55 pm)

lara1, and everyone... I updated the timeline with more tings last night so we could have a better reference of where Liz was in life 2 years ago.

 

East coast -  I like the idea of Kaplan saying she was doing so on Red's behalf , as that's what she did with Liz and Cuba. And it is her story arc so that would make sense. I just can't figure out how Krilov  didn't know her.

I am having severe withdrawal because I have not been able to do a re-watch -  episode still hasn't come up via OnDemand through my cable provider!  I'm not sure how the network can get reliable info on t+3 viewing when it's not even made available. Each week it seems to appear on a different day following the Thursday viewing. First time it hasn't appeared by Sunday though.

Oh well. I will have to postpone further episode sleuthing for now. Thanks for the timeline update!🙂

Lara, that's what I use too. The app is great and it is there the next day.  You can also go to NBC website and watch. I am too impatient to wait on cable!! 😄

Eastcoast and Lara - I watched on the app for the iPad. Sound quality was pretty good, also. I got impatient with my cable provider, too!

Well I finally got to re-watch!  

What a beautifully executed episode.  The scene with Kaplan and Red telling the story of Hans was  perfectly done, and very affecting, and Spader's acting was superb as it was throughout the episode.

Diego excelled in his moments as Ressler, very well done.  It was great to see his potential being used again, to great effect.  And the scene between he and Megan was also very well done.  I have missed their interactions!

Bad Liz was back and it was great to watch.  The humor in the episode was low key but good, in keeping with what is becoming an increasingly grave situation.  The double jump with Red and Werner was great - I never saw it coming and I probably haven't been that surprised by Red;s reaction to a blacklister maybe since the surprise ambush of Geoff Perle.  

Susan was great as the determined Kaplan and Lahti was very deliciously evil like Hitchens.  Yes the memory planting is fringe science but that's the Blacklist.  

I think its interesting that they brought back the memory thing.  Its kind of been the silent elephant in the room through the series and especially this season, with Kirk and Liz's memories of the summer palace.  I do think Tatiana is onto something with it, we have various memory hints starting with Red's poisoning and even before that, with Kirk telling Red that he remembers was Katarina did and not who she was.  But that's now discussed on the other thread.

I very much like Ryan Eggold, but I have to say the episodes are moving so much better without Tom.  The domestic story with Liz and Tom was kind of like a speed bump which interfered with the story, in IMO.  A very good friend of mine who is a regular and casual viewer (meaning he watches each episode but is not a part of any fandom and never looks at spoilers or reads articles etc) surprised me with a comment out of the blue "The show is so much better without Tom and the focus back on Red and Liz". He is now back to live watching whereas he was DVRing most of the season.   I do hope that the writers think of a clever way to resolve it.

Lots and lots of symbols, tb continued.....LOL  

Last edited by lara1 (5/09/2017 10:29 pm)

Additional notes on the episode

Sorry to be so late to the party with these comments.  Several of us already noted the various symbols in the episode.  I won't repeat those but just add a couple of additional things I noticed.  Apologies if someone else already pointed these out!

In the opening scene, when Krilov is altering the memory of the guy, he says to him, among other things:
"You are safe."  hmmm

Musical bookends = "Dreamer" opens the episode, "Dream On" closes it.  Nice parallels.

The entire ice rink scene is a fiesta of red, white and blue.  The structure of the building itself is principally read and white.  The scenes of the body bags on the ice - overwhelmingly red and blue against the white ice.  Large American flag hanging over the scene.

Christmas references:  these were noted individually, but taken together its interesting:

- Two people called "Nicholas" - in the opening scene, Krilov is trying to wipe the memory of the killing of a man called Nicholas; Red's secret man in Werner's employ is also "Nicholas".  I do wonder if the first reference has meaning to Liz's altered memories given Red's link to the name and the fact that it is part of memory altering
-Christmas presents mentioned by Liz
-truck scene with the animals like a nativity with the gift of Red's hat to the child

I noted this before but picked it up more specifically on the re-watch:  Liz has been wearing a specific small floral motif for the past few episodes.  In this one:

- at the beginning, Liz is wearing a black shirt and the top back of it has a design of tiny flower cut outs
-she has the black scarf with a print consisting of tiny blue, white and orangey flowers in a  similar shape
-she wears a different black shirt toward the end, the top front has that same floral motif with the tiny blue, white and orangey flowers again in the same shape

The scarf has been around the past few episodes.  The pattern doesn't harken back to either ballet girl or bubble girl from what I can see.  I do think its circling back to something, but can't think of what.  Anyone have any ideas?  to me its a very vague, suggestive of florals on Russian nesting dolls, but not quite.

Kate - once again wearing Katarina's maroon coat (the one she wore to Cape May and elsewhere). I wonder if Katerina will end up being behind all of this.  Maybe the Russian floral motif (or what I think is a Russian floral motif) is as well?  Any thoughts?

LOL  
 

Last edited by lara1 (5/10/2017 5:43 pm)

HI Tatiana.  You have a point re Megan's wardrobe.  Though I couldn't resist researching the motif anyway!  LOL
It does resemble the floral pattern on Russian nesting dolls and similar Russian folklore floral motifs.  I wasn't able to pinpoint it further than that or to get much on the history that would be relevant.

Maybe just coincidence!