Colleen #40 - would love to join you in the box (!) , however I am out of town as part of Thanksgiving holiday.

You'll have to report back how it was!  I seem to have found something online somewhere, where Amir and Hashim were there, maybe two weeks ago.  I'm not sure whether the photos were released by Sony, but as I understand it, its all set up in part of their (SONY's) new headquarters in Manhattan.  I believe they moved there within the last year, not sure where they were before that.    If you don't know NY, its also across from a very nice park, and in fact, The Blacklist was filming in the park on Monday - check out Aly Blacklist for photos.

Last edited by lara1 (11/04/2016 3:42 pm)

Yes thanks Tuxie400 - happy holidays to all!  (and maybe we will one day solve the mystery of Red as St. Nick and what it all means! )  All the best, fellow Blacklist refugees!

Hi Everyone!  Hope you enjoy this special time of year  :-)

Hello Everyone!  Here’s my long overdue book report, with a mouthful of a title.  “The Krampus and the Old, Dark Christmas: Roots and Rebirth of the Folkloric Devil” was written by Al Ridenour.  Has cool photos of people dressed in Krampus and other costumes for various events.  Also contains reprints of old postcard and photos, and a map so the reader can see where all the events are held in Europe (mainly in Austria and Germany).

I put in capital letters what seem to be parallel Blacklist and Krampus themes.  It will probably take one or two more posts to include everything I want to - I REALLY had a lot of fun drawing parallels, so went a little overboard  

The Blacklist link to Krampus is in The Arsonist comic book, with Red telling Liz that he once attempted to wear a Krampus costume during a visit to Salzburg, Germany .  The Arsonist occurred at Christmastime, so it is chock full of Christmas references, an ongoing theme in The Blacklist.  The comic even has a page showing The Director talking with Solomon as Solomon guts a deer he apparently got while hunting (poor Rudolf, I thought).  But The Arsonist will be another book report for another day… and now back to Krampus…

The Krampus book starts out by stating “Christmas requires the darkness.  Every child understands that it’s only at midnight the Christmas mystery unfolds… as they await that curious night traveler traversing skies in archaic costume and prophet’s beard.” The phrase “dead of winter” sets the stage for these German and Austrian traditions, when there is little to do but wait for springtime and sit around a fire telling stories to pass the time.  Enter the Krampus to make sure that children don’t get into mischief during this dull, boring time.  Traditional role of the Krampus is that he works with St. Nicholas.  St. Nick rewards children’s good behavior and Krampus punishes their bad behavior.

The tame punishments were kids receiving coal or getting whipped.  The extreme punishments were kids getting snatched from their families or eaten alive.  The eaten alive punishment seems ironic given that kids’ misdeeds could include unsafe behaviors like playing near water or playing with matches (things that could hurt the kids).  So, don’t do something that could hurt yourself, sonny, or I’ll have Krampus kill you.  Lovely.

Like in The Blacklist, the book highlights a DUALITY theme, “The figure of Krampus cannot be understood apart from that of St. Nicholas.  In a sense, the harsh, punishing devil merely externalizes a shadow side of the saint.”  We need the darkness/bad/punishment to truly appreciate the light/good/reward.  However, if Krampus gets too rowdy or scary while visiting with children, St. Nicholas will intervene and tell him to knock it off.  Krampus and St. Nicholas need each other to effectively do their jobs.

St. Nicholas is described as “the Holy Nicholas,” “The Holy Man,” “The Good Man,” and “The Friend of Children.”

The book highlights a St. Nicholas theme of PROTECTING CHILDREN.  Associated with St. Nicholas is a child-murder and cannibalism legend. Three schoolboys stayed overnight at an inn where the innkeeper couple kills the boys in their sleep, chops them up, and adds them to a tub of meat they intend to sell.  St. Nicholas drops by in the morning and resurrects the boys.  In The Blacklist, from the Pilot onward there are many instances of Red and the task force protecting children.

A second legend highlights HELPING A FATHER PROVIDE FOR HIS CHILDREN.  St. Nicholas hears that a poor neighbor doesn’t have enough money to provide his three virgin daughters with dowries, so he can’t marry them off.  So he decides to sell the girls into prostitution instead.  St. Nicholas anonymously gives the man three bags of gold so the daughters can avoid a life of prostitution.  In The Blacklist, Red repeatedly takes care of the families of men he’s killed or of his employees. Red also repeatedly tells Liz that he looks out for her because he knew her father.

There is another folklore character called Perchta who is basically a female witch version of Krampus that disembowels misbehaving children.  She travels in the night sky with the souls of those who were “somehow MISPLACED BY FATE, in particular, those who have died before their time.” These are folks such as unbaptized infants, those who completed suicide, those killed by weapons (including soldiers), witches, and wizards.  Their souls are TRAPPED IN LIMBO as they can’t get into heaven or hell or return to mortal life.  Over the years, Perchata’s gang evolved from merely being spooky or tragic and into being malevolent.  The themes of being uprooted by fate and prevented from moving forward/onward seem to match what Red has been going through, although we don’t yet know his full story.  Red told Madelyn Pratt that he met Liz through fate.  In Marvin Gerard, Red mentioned trying to find his way home and believed that Liz would help make that happen.

The MISPLACED BY FATE and TRAPPED IN LIMBO  themes also seem to fit the aftermath of Liz killing Tom Connolly.  Both Liz and Red went on the run, displaced, and couldn’t go home.  Red said to her “When you killed the Attorney General, you stepped out of your world and into mine.”  When Red had Marvin Gerard work out Liz’s plea deal with Laura Hitchens, Liz hesitated to sign the deal because she could no longer be an FBI agent.  Red said, “Maybe in the future I can get you all the way back, but for now sign the deal.” What’s especially neat is that Red WAS able to get Liz all the way back to being an FBI agent.  He succeeded in saving a lost soul - helping Liz return to the life she used to live.

Incidentally, some of Perchta’s souls took on the shape of dogs – this SHAPE SHIFTING theme is occasionally seen in The Blacklist – Lady Ambrosia when children are supposedly turned into butterflies.  Or when characters appear to be what they really aren’t (Tom Bond posing as a school teacher or Gregory Devry impersonating Raymond Reddington).

The book mentions other fairytales/folklore characters that shapeshift into incognito old beggars asking for food or help with chores (like picking apples from a tree because the beggar is too old to do it herself) to test the kindness of people, mainly children.  While the children pass the test, their stingy or lazy parents punish them for being generous.  The children are rewarded and the parents are punished.  One story tells of a girl who fed a shapeshifting witch named Holle or Holda, which angered her stingy father (who happened to be a BEEKEEPER) so much that he hit the girl.  TO PUNISH HER FATHER, THE SHAPESHIFTER SET THE FAMILY’S HOUSE ON FIRE, KILLING THE FATHER BUT LEAVING THE GIRL UNHARMED DESPITE BEING WITHIN THE FLAMES.

To be continued... still doing some editing...

Last edited by Colleen (3/07/2017 3:26 pm)

That is certainly interesting! I haven't been able to find out much about Witch Holle/Holda on the web yet. That's quite a book report!!!

Just adding two more prior references that I don't think I added here at the time, only in the episode discussion.

Adrian Shaw, 4.07

When Samar meets the Coroner in the restaurant, one of the framed pictures in the next booth is about Christmas.  I can't read the second word, but it might be "musical"….not sure.  If so that would be cool, combining Christmas and music...

Red calls himself  "the ghost of Christmas past…"

Interesting as Emma is referred to by one of the writers as the ghost of Christmas future.  So who is the ghost of Christmas present?  

And does any of it connect to the ghosts of Red's past coming for him now?  or that he feels in the corners of the room?
 

Hi Tuxie400.  Red said "and I'm the ghost of Christmas past" in 4.07.   I can't recall offhand who he said that to - I just had that in my notes.

Wow I had no idea TBL had so many Christmas references - thanks everyone for posting them!

Forget the episode name, but I looked at screenshots of when Nick's Pizza delivered pizza and invitations to the post office gang. Well, maybe invitation isn't the right word when Red tells you to meet with him... Anyway, the delivery guy has the number 615 on his jacket, in big letters. Anyone have any ideas if the number is significant? Laura1 I know you made some great discoveries with numbers - 36 and the movie 36 Hours comes to mind.

I looked up stuff for the year 615 and for June 15th but drew a blank. Best I could find was something from the Bible - will post it tomorrow from work - that fits Red but seems too much like reading a vague horoscope and forcing it to fit Red. Not sure if that makes sense, It's soooo past my bedtime.

The other 615 thing I found was Project 615 - a Soviet Union submarine program or some type of smaller submarines. NATO used the codename Quebec when talking about the Soviet subs. Turns out one of the subs caught fire in the Baltic Sea and most of the crew died. But given how little there is online about the Soviet subs or the sub that caught fire, I can't figure out why The Blacklist writers would give it such prominence.

The book First Salvo was all about a submarine war with the Soviets, and a lead character had a bunch of parallels with Red. Will have to check the book again to see if 615 is mentioned in it.

But given that 615 is tied with Nick's Pizza, I expected the number to be linked to St Nicholas or Christmas. Can't figure it out :-\

Colleen and Honey West - all interesting ideas about 615.  I wonder two things:

1.  Whether 615 is a time - I've been looking into the clocks and times on the clocks.  6:15 is kind of the opposite of !1:45 (one of the times on the clock in the fire memories).  I have also seen a bunch of references to times between 5 o'cock and 6o"clock though I can't connect it yet...if it is connected....

2.  The important numbers all reduce down to 3, not sure why, and a lot reference 12 (the month of Christmas incidentally). which itself reduces down to 3.   in numerology, 615 reduces down to 12 which in turn reduces down to 3.  What 12 and 3 mean I don't know, but a lot of the major numbers we see in the series reduce down that way.

Last edited by lara1 (3/10/2017 12:28 am)

Thank you for the kind words and input, Everyone! 

Lara1 - I'm sure you're onto something with the 615 time reference and also with the submarine!