How Can Liz be Red’s daughter but Red not be her father?  Another idea….. 

So, with our recent discussions of DNA tests, I went back to the internet in search of info for my wild theory (I went to the right place, LOL!) 

I don't know if anyone remembers but one of my wilder theories over the summer after my series re-watch was that Liz was somehow connected to Red's "lost" daughter, and that DNA was somehow involved....so Red sees Liz as his "daughter" or the closest thing he has to a daughter/replacement daughter. 

Honey West, I know that you provided us with some links to articles about how bone marrow transplants can alter the DNA so (I think) that the blood produced by the recipient after the transplant has the DNA of the donor..I think that's right.  So I was doing some more research on that.

 This may have already been mentioned by someone, but I again looked into the "chimera" effect - when a person can have a large percentage of a sibling's DNA or have the DNA of two people (themselves and another person) by a process that could be the result of  a bone marrow transplant, or something else.  The other way is by the absorption of the DNA of a twin prior to birth, either because the twin dies before reaching birth, or otherwise.

 I found the attached article and some other stories.  In one story, a woman in  England had the DNA of her twin brother, and two blood types, even though he survived until the age of 3.  It seems she had absorbed her twin brother’s DNA prior to birth.   In another story, a couple underwent paternity testing for their son.  They were surprised when the father did not test as the father.  Apparently what had happened is that the father had absorbed the DNA of his fraternal twin brother (the son’s “uncle”) prior to birth.  Because of this, the paternity test showed the brother (“uncle’) as the father (but the twin had died).  So in paternity tests the real father didn't test as the father, even though he was.  Technically,  the brother (the son's "uncle") was both father and uncle, from a DNA perspective. (I've just gone back to edit this for clairty, to say that it wasn't that the son showed none of the real father's DNA.  But the percentage of the real father's DNA that the test showed was below the threshold to provide a son/father match - because the father had his brother's DNA as well.  hope that makes sense!)

So I'm wondering if something like this happened with Liz.  So did Red have a twin brother, and is Red's brother Liz's father,?  If something like what I described had happened, technically Red would not be her father but she could be considered as his daughter?  We've also had hints of twins somewhere in the series and some think that Red is really Red's twin brother  (I'm not sure about that, only stating that the idea is out there....)  That would certainly be complicated too!   

Maybe not, maybe that is just too too wild! !!  I'm just trying to tie in all of the DNA/genetic splitting/engineering themes we have seen.  Maybe the DNA//genetic thing comes up in some other way.  Well it was fun looking into all of this….thanks for reading!  

 https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/3-human-chimeras-that-already-exist/

 

Last edited by lara1 (2/15/2017 1:18 am)

Honey West #63 - Yes, good point, and all of the stem cell/bone marrow donation talk during the Kirk arc made me wonder whether she and Kirk were not a match because her DNA had been changed when she was young in order to "keep her safe" - but the question would remain, from what? or whom? and why?  So many questions!!!!!

Thanks Tatiana #65 , I read the attached and its interesting.  I have a  couple of initial thoughts:

- I do think that Red had a daughter who either died or disappeared, and I do think that her name was Elizabeth.  "Flora Segunda" kind of points me in that direction re the name of his daughter being that of LIz.  (That's why I think the "Elizabeth is my daughter" comment to Kirk is suspect.)  that's just my opinion, of course.
- I do think that its possible and maybe even probable that Red gave "Masha" his lost daughter's name and identity.  Again, just my opinion.  (To add a wild theory, was her DNA swapped out with his as well, through stem cells/bone marrow transplant, which I guess in some ways might maker her his "daughter" but him not her "father"...I don't know.... I also don't know if the technology existed back then to even do so. Probably too wild even for TBL! But the would certainly make it complicated!)
- Putting that all aside, I'm not sure that Red is Liz's father.  I think there are too many conflicting statements and actions in the series to be fully convinced of that yet.

The theory in the attached is interesting. I have watched that scene before with JE talking at Comicon.   I do think that the end game will be more complex than Red is her father, but what, I don't know.  What the attached theory doesn't explain though is why, for all of those years, Red looked after Liz, had photos sent to him etc and chose to come back to protect her.  There has to be something deeper to those early years that we don't know.  Something that drove him to put her above all else for so long in so many ways.  My wild theory of Liz being technically his "daughter" or "replacement daughter" might be one., but even ignoring that as too far-fetched, I think it has to be something more.  

 I personally don't put too much into what was cut out of the pilot, but that's just me.  There could be any number of reasons why they chose to omit what they did.  Maybe they wanted to make it less Hannibal-ish because that's not where they wanted to go with it. Still,  I think the possibilities are open........something more to watch for when viewing!  Well that's my two cents!  What do you think?

Last edited by lara1 (2/15/2017 12:45 am)

Tatiana - I thought ballerina girl looked much older than 7 - more like 9-11. I've never interpreted Red's interactions with Liz to be lustful. I think Reddington's behavior toward Liz in the pilot was to throw her, the FBI, and the viewer off the trail of their true relationship. Other than that, I've never interpreted Red's intereactions with Liz to be lustful. The only other "lusty" moment for me was in Liz's Season 2 dream featuring Tom and Red. I don't know how Red would have given Masha his daughter's identity if they were different ages. I do love the Tumblr blog you reference, but I don't subscribe to her theory.