Tatiana wrote:

It has nothing to do with creative process or great plot design:

our television world is puppetted about in grand negotiations by people who have never watched the show, hawking viewer ratings to the highest bidders, trading players because they need to fill a 30 minute slot....
 

Agree. It's an unfortunate reality that tv is based on money and ratings and views, and not strictly a creative endeavor that never worries about such mundane and counter-creative considerations!   But it does and sometimes the shows suffer as a result.  When they cancelled Person of Interest I read somewhere that the writers wanted to concentrate on the mythology for the last shortened season but the station/and/or/studio wanted them to keep up the number of the week format until the end. It dragged down the final season storytelling to keep having to have a number involved, especially because all the viewers knew it was the last season.  With the Blacklist, in a recent interview Bokencamp said he wanted to reveal Red as an imposter at the end of Season 1 but was talked out of it so they could stretch the story out over more seasons. I think the story suffered some by being dragged out so long. I think the show would have had so much more punch had they not been interfered with by the money people and didn't  worry so much about staying on the air and having material for 7 seasons, and just told the story at the same pace as Season1 was going - which is still my favorite season.   For instance, they basically dragged out this whole season just to reveal the imposter story.  The mythology part of the series told in the last 4 seasons could have all been told in Season 2 and the show would have been tighter.  And I bet they could have kept going, even if they revealed it all in Season 2. There could still have been stories to be told. 
 

Hello, Everyone!  Apologies in advance, as I skip around and probably accidentally repeat stuff and such, in the hopes of somewhat catching up on this place--which is no easy feat, since it tends to be hopping!  

Gah!  First off, how exquisite is it that we now get to go back and draw up a whole other timeline, carefully trying to decipher and pick apart what stories and realities and truths belong to our Red versus the original Red?  I suppose if we have to have such a long break, at least we have lots of things to sink our teeth into!

Here's where I am on my thoughts to the overall story, upon the big reveal--which wasn't all that shocking, but a nice confirmation nonetheless!

I think our Red is Katarina's brother--perhaps even a twin, just because it would fit the mirror imagery so well.  Mostly I think this, because it makes sense why there is so much trust between him and Dom, despite this undercurrent of animosity; of disappointment and anger, and frustration and hurt.  

I think Kate hesitated to dig up the bones, out of respect to Katarina--and also because it could cause some kind of memory backlash for Elizabeth.  I mean it's one thing to know you killed your father--but my guess is, it's another when there's concrete proof in front of you. 

I think our Red didn't dispose of the bones in a more permanent kind of way, because he was banking on an out at some point in time.  Over time, when an out seemed more and more like a pipe dream, the name Reddington was already so established, that it made sense to keep it a secret--to keep our Red's remaining family (Dom and Elizabeth) safe. 

Figure by that point in time, the bones wouldn't do him any favors, but it would allow for Elizabeth to have some kind of closure, in the event of his death; it would allow for her father's name to be cleared of all wrongdoings.  (I also kind of think that was the letter he burned to Elizabeth during the Caretaker episode, in the graveyard.)  

I believe our Red's family was killed--his wife and kiddo(s)--most likely due to the Cabal finding out about Katarina's double-cross; they take down whatever of her family they can find.  For all intents and purposes our Red dies that night, so the Cabal doesn't know anyone from Katarina's family is coming for them.  And then he takes over original Red's identity, since original Red had a few connections, and conveniently allotted for a way in.  Also, it would allow for a convincing cover story as to who is pulling all the strings--some star crossed lover bent on exacting revenge.

That being said, our Red is a monster--there's no mistaking that, and the issue hasn't changed.  But I do tend to lead towards him being a manufactured monster of sorts, born out of necessity.  Also, I'm very fond of his flaws:  that he's stubborn, and unwilling to cough up the goods when he really needs to--but I don't want to see an Elizabeth vs. our Red fight for the entirety of next season.  I like those kiddos better when they work together--exasperated with each other, but working together.  

Or, I could be completely wrong on all of the above.  Either way, I'm looking forward to another year of The Blacklist!  

THAT being said!  I'm super happy Aram and Samar got a happy ending of sorts--AND! that they were able to sneak in a Tom cameo.  It just seemed really, really fitting, to wrap everything up and give a resolution of sorts, even while opening up so many other cans of worms.  

deadkske13 - It's always a pleasure to read your posts. We have missed them.

This is the part of your theory that most captivates me:

"I think our Red didn't dispose of the bones in a more permanent kind of way, because he was banking on an out at some point in time.  Over time, when an out seemed more and more like a pipe dream, the name Reddington was already so established, that it made sense to keep it a secret--to keep our Red's remaining family (Dom and Elizabeth) safe. 

Figure by that point in time, the bones wouldn't do him any favors, but it would allow for Elizabeth to have some kind of closure, in the event of his death; it would allow for her father's name to be cleared of all wrongdoings.  (I also kind of think that was the letter he burned to Elizabeth during the Caretaker episode, in the graveyard.) " 

I have believed Red to be Katarina for quite awhile now. But I can see how the bones would provide an escape valve for the person believed to be RR.  They could either clear original RR's name by proving he had been dead for about 30 years, or turn up as our Red's skeleton in the event he/she decided to retire the identity.
 

Last edited by Tuxie400 (5/20/2018 9:43 pm)

Big Badd Bazzer wrote:

In the interest of brevity and consistency I think we should refer to the original Raymond Reddington - as BONEINGTON . . . . . possibly BURNINGTON.

Feedback appreciated!

 

​Lol!!! 
 

Eastcoast wrote:

Big Badd Bazzer wrote:

In the interest of brevity and consistency I think we should refer to the original Raymond Reddington - as BONEINGTON . . . . . possibly BURNINGTON.

Feedback appreciated!

 

​Lol!!! 
 

Boney or Bernie - for short . . . .

BBB, I had let my guard down.  I should have known you were on a roll and not to be chewing crackers when I read this!! 

I was thinking today about something we first discussed after Refugees was created that should have clued us in that Red might be an imposter.  After Kirk, also known as Constantin Rostov, was put in the orange box, we discussed how everyone housed in that secure holding box had a hidden identity:

Alan Fitch was the Decembrist
Liz Keen was Masha Rostova
Alexander Kirk was Constantin Rostov
Fake Red #1 was Gregory DeVry
Raymond Reddington had many aliases. But now we know Our Red has another real identity.

Last edited by Tuxie400 (5/20/2018 11:40 pm)

Wow! Lots of great thoughts! It's another long work week for me, but I'll chime in when I can!

Thank you for the alert BBB! 

Bernie Bones?  BB.  I see a similarity!! lol 

lara1 wrote:

deadskie13 - hi!  so nice to see you posting!  hope all is well!

Well one of my ideas for a while has been that Dom is a father to Red in some way - biological, adoptive, surrogate, whatever.  But I do tend to lean towards father/son making Red brother to KR.  It would, in part, explain that scene in Cape May where their two faces are side by side by the fireplace - particularly if they are twins.  IDK of course, its just an idea I've had for a while.   In part because I never really believed Red to be Liz's father.  but who knows.  anything goes!  LOL.  

Hi, lara1!  I'm almost always at least a bit of a mess, but I'm slowing finding my footing again.  

My initial reaction with our Red and Dom was a son-in-law/father-in-law kind of deal--only with the undertones of what could have been, since Katarina went another route.  But their relationship definitely has some sort of paternal bits, because I'm not sure just anyone can make Red consume buttermilk.    These days, though, I'm leaning directly father/son.

I remember back on the old forum we kicked around the idea that it would be super cool if Red wasn't Elizabeth's Pops, just because it would be something different--something more, almost, to have two strangers who found themselves remarkably close due to a series of ::achem:: unfortunate of events.  Regardless, I don't think it matters if he's her biological father or not, because the father/daughter relationship is already there.  I just really really really didn't want Constantine to be Lizzy's father.  So, sometimes dreams do come true.  ​