The Blacklist Refugees » Episode 5.13 - The Invisible Hand

Tuxie400 · 2/08/2018 12:06 am

Ah lara, you and your numbers. I can see how a group of six would remind you of Kungur Six.

lara1 · 2/08/2018 12:06 am

Tuxie400 and eastcoast - LOL, yes, who is Red to Dom? haha

I am starting to feel like we have more questions than answers from this episode! LOL

Last edited by lara1 (2/08/2018 12:10 am)

Tuxie400 · 2/08/2018 12:09 am

How do you all feel about Liz coming back to the task force? I, for one, like it because the task force is just boring to me without some Liz and Red interaction with them. I can't take one more episode of someone calling Aram adorable. It was cute the first time. But it's already old by the second time. And, I'm sorry, but Ressler and Navabi investigating those cases every week just don't do it for me. I kind of wish they'd backed off the Blacklist cases for a few weeks until Liz returned.

lara1 · 2/08/2018 12:10 am

Tuxie400 wrote:
Eastcoast - I don't know who Red really is to Dom. LOL I don't think Kaplan knew who Red was to Liz. If those bones are Katarina's and Dom doesn't know it, maybe Kaplan thought Oleander - Katarina's father - would kill Red and get him out of Masha's life once and for all.

that's another interesting take! So, Tom gets a suitcase of bones with instructions from Kaplan to give them to Liz, assuming I guess, that Liz would investigate and the bones would somehow lead her to Oleander....then again it looks like the DNA report gave Tom what he needed to know.

anyway instead Tom decides to try to identify the bones. and things go out of control from there. Dennison, an ally of Kaplan, with his last breath, tells Tom to find Oleander. But why. Questions, questions.

Eastcoast · 2/08/2018 12:13 am

Wilkinson is an English name when I looked it up. Dom told Liz after the cold war he came to this country to teach and granted asylum, citizenship and changed his name. Wonder what it was before?

lara1 · 2/08/2018 12:16 am

Tuxie400 wrote:
How do you all feel about Liz coming back to the task force? I, for one, like it because the task force is just boring to me without some Liz and Red interaction with them. I can't take one more episode of someone calling Aram adorable. It was cute the first time. But it's already old by the second time. And, I'm sorry, but Ressler and Navabi investigating those cases every week just don't do it for me. I kind of wish they'd backed off the Blacklist cases for a few weeks until Liz returned.

I think Liz is best as "action Liz" and that comes mainly via her task force work, although they did compensate for that in recent eps with Liz looking for Tom's killers, and there's probably more of that to come. But the interesting dynamic where Liz is a sort of conduit or counterpoint between Red and the task force, and balancing both is more interesting to watch, than just the task force on their own, at least for me.

Last edited by lara1 (2/08/2018 12:17 am)

Eastcoast · 2/08/2018 12:17 am

I am glad she is back! Yes, a bit boring without her.

Eastcoast · 2/08/2018 12:18 am

It felt like something was missing!

Honey West · 2/08/2018 1:11 am

I haven’t read the discussion yet but all I can say is Oleander is Dom!

That, and I think, even more than before, that Red is still up,to his neck in the spy biz and unless they definitively tell us the bones belong to Katarina, then she is still alive. And living on Reds secret getaway island.

Big Badd Bazzer · 2/08/2018 5:42 am

Tuxie400 wrote:
Eastcoast - I think Kate knrew more than Raymond thought she did.

Agreed. Liz's super-power is incredible profiler and observational skills. She'd pick up on Dom lying to her in a few seconds - if not something on his hutch or wall (ie. clues)

However, last night's biggest reveal was NOT Dom as Oleander - we kinda all realized that one, didn't we? (take a pat on the back everyone)

The big reveal was Ian Garvey in law enforcement. Didn't quite see that one coming - and the Big Boy detective working for him. Liz is in extreme danger - FOR NOW!

Also loved how the Anthony story-line suddenly evolved into Red marrying himself up with Big Willie to take over the Nash syndicate. Red needs more resources - and Anthony's indiscretions gave him an opening into a virtual goldmine of resources.

Anthony continues to be a good supporting character but Big WIlly suddenly emerged as Red's newest/latest ally. Hope he stays around. (but we've said that about many, haven't we?)

Meanwhile back at the ranch - nobody is saying much. Red has to continue lying to Liz. Dom is confused about his grand-daughter finally discovering him. The post office welcomes back Agent Keen. Now evidence of Black Liz in operation last night - but that aspect of her is just in temporary hibernation (I hope). Liz will no doubt be involved in taking down Garvey & The Dirty Detective - while she cobbles together a plan to unravel age-old truths about her origin and family tree. (aka The School of Fishes)

TheYeti · 2/08/2018 5:57 am

Some random thoughts about this episode which I found highly entertaining.
They're really making the plot complex right now (which is something positive). It feels like a lot of characters have been added or connected to the storyline in this episode. I'm very curious about the Nash Syndicate. It seems like they could be a blacklister somewhere in the end of the season. Big Willy told Red they are probably connected by cops, which seems to link to Garvey and maybe even Tommy Markins (was that his name?) who has been mentioned to be a dirty cop in season 3. I've personally hoped to see his confrontation with Ressler some day and this storyline might lead to it as a side story (wishful thinking). After all, Ressler hasn't had a storyline since Prescott was killed a few episodes ago.

Somehow this story of dirty cops reminds me of the HR story line from Person of Interest, and while I have high expectations I doubt they can top that.

Meanwhile, the high-level techniques used by Garvey seem to point to some higher organization involved in everything. I would not be surprised if the Cabal has a role in it all.

Dom was Oleander (glad they confirmed he was lying in the same episode), but his connection to the bones remains unclear. I'm wondering if he has any knowledge about Seaduke. After all, they were both Russian operatives.

One thing bothers me though. Garvey's goal is still unclear to me. I believe he wants to connect to Red, but he seems to make it difficult. For as far as we know, he has not reached out to Naomi, Jennifer or any other connection of Red, despite probably having the means. Even Berlin managed to find Red quite easily, so maybe just finding Red might not actually be Garvey's purpose even though it seemed that simple.

2/08/2018 7:22 am

Honey West wrote:
That, and I think, even more than before, that Red is still up,to his neck in the spy biz and unless they definitively tell us the bones belong to Katarina, then she is still alive. And living on Reds secret getaway island.

That’s my belief too. *high five*

But would she be there of her own free will or is Red keeping her prisoner? Both have their own amazing potential.

Last edited by Brittany (2/08/2018 7:31 am)

RedIsMyCoPilot · 2/08/2018 8:48 am

Perhaps Garvey's a bit perturbed that Red turned himself over on his own...

I tried to fix the format for easier reading... hope it works!

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lara1 · 2/08/2018 9:35 am

The Yeti - #131 - thank you! I'd been wracking my brain since the last episode over where I'd heard the name "Tommy" before and thought it might have been that dirty cop. So, maybe that was a clue to us that dirty cops were involved. Now we know, so I'm wondering if there is anything more (interesting now, Tom's name).

You make a really interesting point about Garvey/Naomi. I was thinking that witness protection was relevant now to the story. Could that be one reason why Red jumped at his chance to get Naomi out of witness protection and under his own protection? He was so insistent about it, threatening Frank etc to get his way. Its an intriguing possibility. Although maybe not, maybe the connection is something else.

It could, as I think you imply, all lead back to Ressler the "dirty cop" of the season , and through the dirty cop that ultimately ended his father's life. (the symbolic link to the storyline) intriguing possibilities!

EDITED: oh yes just to clarify. I don't mean Ressler is behind what is happening. I think he may be drawn back into the storyline and the connection is the Tommy dirty cop that was linked to his father's death. Somehow. maybe just symbolic but it could be that is one of the things that are lining up in the storyline....

Last edited by lara1 (2/08/2018 9:38 am)

lara1 · 2/08/2018 9:40 am

BBB - agree with your comments. The School of Fishes, LOL

lara1 · 2/08/2018 9:47 am

Honey West wrote:
I haven’t read the discussion yet but all I can say is Oleander is Dom!

That, and I think, even more than before, that Red is still up,to his neck in the spy biz and unless they definitively tell us the bones belong to Katarina, then she is still alive. And living on Reds secret getaway island.

hi HoneyWest. I think I remember you suggesting a while back that Red may be holding KR prisoner in some way, either with her approval (as in hiding/protecting her) or not.

This has got me thinking - about that comment back in Season 3 where Red said he's now not sure he knows whatever happened to Katerina. And I was thinking, all these people telling Red to tell Liz the truth, she deserves to know. What could it be? It has to be family related. Some of us thought at one time or another thet Liz had special powers.

We've seen how Kirk had an illness and KR writing that Masha was spared because it could not be inherited through the female genetic line. Just a stretch - but what if KR had some kind of illness that ultimately lead to her being locked away? And Liz may have it too. It could be something rare that hasn't manifested yet. I don't know, there's nothing that really points to that in the storyline. Only possible clues around it. But it would be something that Liz deserved to know.

Unless of course KR is on the island, if she is, of her own free will. Lots of keys to boxes in this show!!

Last edited by lara1 (2/08/2018 9:48 am)

Tuxie400 · 2/08/2018 9:48 am

BBB - So you think Liz knew Dom was lying. I thought he was pretty convincing - except for denying he was Oleander and refusing to talk about Reddington. I could do without seeing Willie again.

Last edited by Tuxie400 (2/08/2018 9:49 am)

lara1 · 2/08/2018 9:51 am

Tuxie400 wrote:
BBB - So you think Liz knew Dom was lying. I thought he was pretty convincing - except for denying he was Oleander and refusing to talk about Reddington. I could do without seeing Willie again.

Tuxie400 - my mind does make strange connections at times (LOL i should write a novel) but I think Big Willie (whose name was Wilkes) was introduced with that scene with the chain saw to make a link to the bones and Dom (Wilkinson). Not that he necessarily disposed of the corpse, but he (Dom) knows about it and the secret. So yes, I think Dom, as Oleander, is connected to the bones.

lara1 · 2/08/2018 9:57 am

Tuxie400 wrote:
Eastcoast - I think Kate knrew more than Raymond thought she did.

I thought some more about this. How could Kate know about Oleander? She could have been an operative with a cover; KR could have told her (as you mentioned) or Kate found out otherwise,either by snooping or by accident.

But then I thought, Kate was probably the one who moved the bones and buried them at Tansi Farms. So she did know the secret. Its possible that Red told her about it. But not about Dom.

I agree with you that Kate maybe didn't know that Red was Liz's father. It certainly wasn't evident in that "first" meeting Kate had with Red in Requiem. Likewise, she may have known about Oleander, but not know that Oleander was Liz's grandfather, or, that Oleander was Dom, or where Dom was.

Or, Red could have been lying to Dom, or fudging the truth.

Take your pick, LOL

Tuxie400 · 2/08/2018 10:01 am

Yeti - The whole dirty cop thing does remind us of Tommy Markin. Wouldn't it be wild if he was somehow involved in Garvey's group?

I agree it doesn't seem clear what Garvey wants with Red. He talked to Tom about Red's power, and originally I thought he just wanted to blackmail Red for financial gain. Not knowing Red is working with the FBI, maybe his plan was to have Red be his asset so he could caputre more fugitives. It does seem like Garvey could have located Red by now - especially if Liz and her apartment were being surveilled. Only time will tell.

Last edited by Tuxie400 (2/08/2018 10:05 am)