The Blacklist Refugees » Episode 5.12 - The Cook

lara1 · 2/04/2018 1:17 pm

Going back to my thoughts on the cook in #58, a stray thought occurred to me about Red's back burns, and whether those were the result of an explosion rather than THE fire - which I think others have talked about before, but the cook did remind me of gas explosion. we had the boiler room explosion too in Luther Braxton. Although I do think it more likely that he was at the fire, I wonder if that scene at the end of Season 1, where we see his burns and he is looking at the Stewmaker photo, is a misdirection.

I say that because we assume the burns are from the fire. But we also assumed that the girl in the photo, Red had a personal connection to her, (daughter, sister, other) yet he did not. It was an overall piece of the BERLIN storyline.

What if the burns were also a piece of the Berlin storyline? Red was framed for the Kursk bombing. This is a stretch, but suppose he was in the room when the bomb went off? That would be a tidy way to both blame him for the bomb and possibly eliminate him. As I recall, the bomb pre-dated his arrangement with Fitch.

I don't know, maybe not. But those burns were revealed in Berlin Conclusion while looking at Berlin's daughter, and the camera then cuts to Berlin looking at the same photo. Probably not the case but its a thought.

Last edited by lara1 (2/04/2018 1:18 pm)

Tuxie400 · 2/04/2018 1:41 pm

lara1 - That's interesting isn't it, that Dickens' Fagin taught orphans to grift and pickpocket? I'm surprised they would name an arsonist Fagen. But maybe his name foreshadows some future reveal about Sam, Red and grifting.

Emma's son was in a boarding school. She'd missed much of his life because of ops she had worked for Red.

As for the number 4, I was thinking it hadn't been used much in The Blacklist. But of course Liz was 4 years old at the time of her "kidnapping" and the fire, and Reddington was missing for four years before resurfacing.

Tuxie400 · 2/04/2018 1:42 pm

lara1 - You are right that it's never been confirmed that Red got his burns from Fire Night. He has confirmed he was at the fire, but he never explained it what capacity.

lara1 · 2/04/2018 1:51 pm

Tuxie400 - I am thinking more about the fires we have seen so far this season. The Cook sets himself on fire, Red sets Prescott on fire. Red gets Fagan paroled, and its likely he will use him in another fire. There were other references to fire, more minor.

I'm thinking those burned skeletons and the other fire references are leading to a huge fire Red is planning. Its obvious I think that Fagan is now in his debt and will set up something for Red. It may even be part of the cliffhanger at the end of the season.

Maybe that is why Red hasn't really taken much action against Garvey or whomever Garvey is working for, if anyone. He has something more vengeful planned for him/them. Mere shooting them is too quick.

IDK, I don't think Fagan set THE fire. I think he set others and Red wants to employ him in whatever Red is planning. Just a gut feeling. I think if Fagan set the original fire, he wouldn't be walking around right now. Maybe Garvey is linked to whomever set the original fire. I'm not sure if anyone has mentioned it but Garvey's glasses have two little crosses on them. A link to The Cook.

I think they are building to an incredible season finale.

Last edited by lara1 (2/04/2018 1:52 pm)

Honey West · 2/04/2018 2:05 pm

Maybe Fagan was an investigator of The Fire?and that’s how Red knew him.

Lara1, I thought it was one of the Johns who confirmed recently that Liz and Red's scars came from the same fire and that it was the fire in Requiem.

Tuxie400 · 2/04/2018 2:06 pm

lara1 - There have been fires all season. The first one was in The Endling when the barn of horses is set on fire. Then in Ian Garvey, there's Tom using Molotov cocktails to torch two cars belonging to the Garvey gang. Next we have Liz's two human blazes in Ruin, and, as you mentioned, Prescott in The Informant going up in flames at Red's hand. Now the Cook - an episode with fires galore and murder by arson. Setting people ablaze is definitely a theme that is accelerating. And I would expect the most shocking fire of all to be in the finale.
I do think we will get some more information about Fire Night this season, and I agree that Fagen was not likely responsible for our mythic fire. But I wonder if perhaps he wasn't working the fire as an investigator in its aftermath. He's old enough to have been working for a fire department back then. (Honey West - I see we were posting the same brilliant idea at about the same time!)

Last edited by Tuxie400 (2/04/2018 2:07 pm)

Tuxie400 · 2/04/2018 2:08 pm

Honey West wrote:
Maybe Fagan was an investigator of The Fire?and that’s how Red knew him.

Lara1, I thought it was one of the Johns who confirmed recently that Liz and Red's scars came from the same fire and that it was the fire in Requiem.

Honey West - Brittany posted something the other day about thinking Bokenkamp had confirmed Red got his scars on Fire Night. I've listened and read almost every Bokenkamp intereview, and that's something I don't recall. Do either of you remember when this interview was?

Honey West · 2/04/2018 2:14 pm

Most excellent observations Tuxie400 #59!

Monsters hunting monsters. But isn’t that the basic theme of the show with Red as the main monster hunting other monsters?

Funny thing about the last victim. In the previews when we only saw her all wrapped up with just her eyes showing I kept thinking it was Samar. And then when she and Ressler were almost trapped by him I kept thinking, oh no, this is where he captures Samar!

Good work!

Honey West · 2/04/2018 2:17 pm

Tuxie400, I need to find that interview. I think it was one of those quickie little things that pop up from time to time and I just figured everyone had seen it so I didn’t post a link. I will get back to that as soon as I find it.

Tuxie400 · 2/04/2018 2:47 pm

Honey West - In the previews, I thought it was Samar all wrapped up too.

Tuxie400 · 2/04/2018 2:57 pm

When I do a search on Bokenkamp and Red's back burns, the only think I've found is from 2014:

Red is covered in burn scars, so clearly he was in that same fire that apparently claimed the life of Liz's father. Could he be related to her in some other way?
Bokenkamp: It's safe to say that he is connected to her past in some deeply emotional way. Either that, or maybe he was a firefighter in another life. [Laughs] They both have an understanding of [the mythology between them], but don't really have the whole picture. Like Red says at the end of the finale, "You can choose this and confront it or you can hide from it." She's part of the story now and she really doesn't have much of a choice other than to go forward.

lara1 · 2/04/2018 3:37 pm

Honey West wrote:
Maybe Fagan was an investigator of The Fire?and that’s how Red knew him.

Lara1, I thought it was one of the Johns who confirmed recently that Liz and Red's scars came from the same fire and that it was the fire in Requiem.

HoneyWest, thanks. I remember him saying that about Liz's scar in Requiem, because I think he clarified it since it wasn't clear she had a burn/scar in that episode. But hadn't heard that about Red. Possible, though. I tend to think its more likely he did get the burns in THE fire. Maybe there was a gas explosion there.....

Tuxie400 - thanks for that. He doesn't directly address the burns (typical LOL). But I am more inclined to think its fire related.

I wonder if Red's burn scars will be revealed to anyone? I think the FBI knows, even though they weren't mentioned in the pilot. (for dramatic reasons - if we had heard that right away it would have given away something they inched up to throughout the season and revealed in the finale)

deadskie13 · 2/04/2018 3:52 pm

Tuxie400 wrote:
The Liz we have now has never been more focused on a goal. Her frustration with Red is very high, and I think she's still in the anger stage of grief. That anger spills over on Red. Trust has always been a complicated business between these two. But they've never been this honest with each other before. Red's told Liz as much as he can at this point. She's announced her intentions to him. It will be interesting to see how it all plays out.

Agreed! I just don't want the overall final-final plot to end up being Liz vs. Red. I think the best bits in the show are when they work together. Dramatics and irritants and eye rolls--but working together. ^-^

deadskie13 · 2/04/2018 4:01 pm

Honey West wrote:
Maybe Fagan was an investigator of The Fire?and that’s how Red knew him.

Lara1, I thought it was one of the Johns who confirmed recently that Liz and Red's scars came from the same fire and that it was the fire in Requiem.

I thought so, too. And to me, the way in which the scars were presented, it was kind of like a final answer--a payoff to the end of a season; a reason to establish a connection between Red and Liz. So I tend to lean more towards his scars being a result of the fire. But this show is always a lot of fun with all the what ifs? Figure we may not always go in the right direction with our thoughts and theories and ideas--but it's so much fun getting there, nonetheless! :D

2/04/2018 4:10 pm

i think the interview I saw where they had confirmed that Red and Liz were burned in the same fire way back in season 1 or 2 (in a written interview). Or maybe I saw it on Twitter? Then in Requirm they confirmed Red was the guy in the car and the one who took Liz, but I dont remember if they mentioned the fire specifically. I'll have to see if I can find it. But whether the Fritzel Fire is the same fire as “the fire” will remain to be seen undoubtedly.

Last edited by Brittany (2/04/2018 4:59 pm)

Tuxie400 · 2/04/2018 5:28 pm

One more thing about The Cook that I forgot to put in my big post.

Tadashi's mom said what we have heard Liz say to Red in the past: "I am through with you. Finished."
Mama Ito said it to Tadashi. I thought it was kind of funny. Liz is in position now, needing Red's help to exact her revenge on Damascus, that she wasn't able to say it.

Tuxie400 · 2/04/2018 5:32 pm

I've always believed Red got the scars in Liz's fire. That's why I thought I would have remembered a Bokenkamp confirmation.

lara1 · 2/04/2018 10:24 pm

I rewatched the ep tonight. Some more subtle fire clues:

The note on the whiteboard left for Red "We know the truth" with the two magnets that look like the bronze pennies......was left on top of the stove in the house. You can see the burners underneath it. (Yet another GAS stove reference)

OK is it my imagination or does Agnes now look like 4 years old....the age Liz was at the time of the fire. And did anyone notice that her hair is now very dark brown, almost black. Whereas baby Agnes and high chair Agnes had reddish-blond hair. Also are her eyes now brown, or a dark color? I didn't catch that and I couldn't get another glimpse without re-watching the ep Baby and high chair Agnes had blue-ish eyes, didn't she?

Loads of C and K Christmas references:

The Cook of course
the two Japanese insects Red mentions at the beginning (I forget the first, the second is the KATYdid)
The sect's church is located in Cromwell (UK reference too)
The victim's name is Claire, her boyfriend was Kevin

2 religious Christmas references - Cooper says, Mary, Mother of God around the middle of the ep. Ressler says Jesus Christ, towards the end.

Tuxie400 - thanks for the recap of the other fire images. Its interesting that each of the fires was one of two things: either the victim of the fire was locked into a prison like structure and could not escape; or some kind of fire accelerant was poured on the victims and/or the person set alight. It reminded me of Season 1 where Red pours the liquor over the guy and lights the cigar.......

Last edited by lara1 (2/04/2018 10:25 pm)

lara1 · 2/04/2018 10:33 pm

I focused on the basement this time around. It is like a time capsule 1970s museum. Everything - from the paneled walls to the wall decor (esp this sort of sand pebble pictures) to the clock to the barstools and the lights as well as the posters and the bicycle seemed from the mid 1970s. I think the young Red would have been right at home there with his bologna sandwich. (I think I remember the reference - wasn't Red saying he was in the basement eating sandwiches during the chess tournament with Bobby Fischer?)

Interestingly, the time on the clock when Garvey bursts in looks like about 10 minutes to 12 - so right before the fire was set, yes?

Did anyone see what those brightly colored things were in the clear glass jar next to the computers and the collection of screwdrivers and scissors? They were in nearly every shot between Liz and whiz kid but I could not figure out what they were....

I was trying to get details on three things - the trophies on the shleves along the wall - can anyone make out what the trophy with the red ribbons says? There is a kind of tag on the bottom with a word on it.

The sci fi posters on the walls - especially the one between Red and Dembe when they speak - anyone recognize what they are/where they are from?

Last edited by lara1 (2/04/2018 10:35 pm)

Tuxie400 · 2/04/2018 10:34 pm

lara1 - On your C/K references, the first victim was emergency room Dr. Corinne.