The Blacklist Refugees » Possible Parallels

lara1 · 2/17/2018 7:18 pm

Tuxie400 wrote:
Just another thought about the hearts: they were all shown in connection with someone who died.

Very interesting observation. Dang, I wish I could remember those two small hearts I saw. Now I can't even remember whether it was Season 5 or my Season 1 re-watch that I did over the winter hiatus.

Question: did we ever see the reverse side of KR's locket? I think it was round, with the inscription on one side. But she was wearing it in Mato and (maybe?) in Requiem. did anyone ever see an enlarged photo of it? though I would bet it was probably a flower motif or something like that.

Last edited by lara1 (2/17/2018 7:19 pm)

lara1 · 2/17/2018 7:27 pm

Tuxie400 wrote:
Now that I'm looking for parallels connected to fire memories, I realize the motel swimming pool with the little girl diving for quarters in Smokey Putnam is a parallel to Liz diving deep into her unconscious in the drained swimming pool in Luther Braxton II.

that's interesting. When I watched that scene I focused on the coins. Red, spending his time with children, throwing them quarters to dive for and which they could probably keep. And the coins, as in a magic trick.

Tuxie400 · 2/17/2018 7:54 pm

lara1 - Katarina's locket was round. She was shown wearing it in both Mato and Requiem (every scene). But it's so small that when you blow it up, the detail is out of focus.

The coins do connect to the penny and the magic tricks this season, but the swimming pool connects to the Season 2 fire memory session.

Tuxie400 · 2/17/2018 8:15 pm

This season has had the most uses of the term sweetheart - a dozen - nearly every episode.. While it has been used a few times in all of the other seasons, the most memorable is the man who put Masha in the closet saying, "Ok, stay here sweetheart. No matter what happens, you need to stay here and not come out till I come to get you."

This season started with Red eluding the police in the red Corvette while talking to Liz. "Sorry sweetheart, I need to get off."

Miss Rebecca Thrall asked her S and M partner, "Did you miss me, sweetheart?"

Nirah the Endling told her son: Sweetheart please, just come get some rest.

Red used sweetheart twice in Ilyas Surkov when talking to Coco the bulldog:
"Come on, sweetheart. That's it."
"Coco, the pleasure was all mine, sweetheart."

In the Travel Agency, Eleanor called Calvin sweetheart three times.

Tommy Wattles called his victim, Claire, sweetheart twice in The Cook.

In The Invisible Hand, Liz tells Cleveland Bandicott he built the unit for the Navarro's artificial eye. "I don't know who that is, sweetheart," he replies. Liz aims the soldering gun at him and says, "Call me sweetheart again..."
"

lara1 · 2/17/2018 8:18 pm

interesting link - and In braxton, Liz was being tortured in an empty, drained swimming pool. By being waterboarded. Red was kind of waterboarding in the bathtub one of the burglars in the episode where he sets up the criminal bnb with tony the post office guy. so maybe there's the waterboarding link too. interesting.

I agree there is a parallel between the two scenes. But I wonder if its a parallel to both parts, or only the one part. (ie waterboarding or memory regression or both).

And Cape May finds us with KR in the bathtub. Have to think on that one for a while.....

Last edited by lara1 (2/17/2018 8:20 pm)

lara1 · 2/17/2018 8:22 pm

oh, and that comment in the last episode about Anna wanting to get back to the hotel to take a bath.

so I'm thinking there is some kind of KR reveal later this season, whether or not its her bones that were buried.

lara1 · 2/17/2018 8:23 pm

Tuxie400 #24 - yes I noticed those too - wonder if it ties into the overall "heart" theme in some way......

lara1 · 2/17/2018 8:25 pm

Oh, and i think one of the goons in Ruin called Liz Sweetheart.

And didn't Dom call Liz that in the last episode? Or did I just imagine that. LOL sorry if that's a false alarm.

Tuxie400 · 2/17/2018 8:33 pm

Those 12 are the only uses of sweetheart so far. I did a search on each episode. I guess you just wanted Dom to call Liz sweetheart.

lara1 · 2/17/2018 8:35 pm

Just thinking about the sweetheart thing. I think Red called Liz Sweetheart again later in the season. Or maybe someone else - but I think I remember him saying it and not to Coco.

Also - did Garvey call Lena or Liz sweetheart? I can't recall but it seems like something he would say.

I think you may be onto something. Note that most of the times, its the blacklister of the week who calls someone sweetheart. And Red.

Maybe we'll find out who put Liz in the closet on fire night. That would be a start.

lara1 · 2/17/2018 8:36 pm

Tuxie400 wrote:
Those 12 are the only uses of sweetheart so far. I did a search on each episode. I guess you just wanted Dom to call Liz sweetheart.

Yes maybe! well he did come close, he called her a kind person or something like that.

Tuxie400 · 2/17/2018 8:39 pm

Yeah, I think there is a waterboarding link with Liz and the scene with Red and Dembe with that guy in the bathtub in The Endling. And maybe the Stewmaker plot line just got them thinking about throwing in some more tubs.

Last edited by Tuxie400 (2/24/2018 10:51 am)

Tuxie400 · 2/17/2018 8:43 pm

We need some kind of Katarina reveal, and I'm on board with it coming this season. But I think since everyone is thinking about Katarina again, the reveal we'll get is about Fire Night. Spader said some whacked out thing in a recent podcast about TBL evealing stuff when the audience has stopped asking questions about it.

lara1 · 2/17/2018 8:52 pm

Tuxie400 - have you searched for "heart". its very interesting how much that word is used, in all sorts of phrases, this season, and in a lot of the song lyrics too.

but what does it mean.....LOL.

Maybe a reveal about Liz. the original sweetheart, and with that heart tattoo (another symbol - tattoos!) on Lena's wrist, right in the spot where Liz's scar is.....

Well we will know soon enough......

Tuxie400 · 2/17/2018 9:20 pm

lara1 - As for heart, it's very common in both songs and dialog (probably of most shows). So far, heart (when included in sweetheart or heartthrob etc.) is found 46 times so far this season. Numerous times were in The Endling because of the son needing the heart transplant. In Season 1 and Season 2 heart is found 47 times, in Season 3 and 4, 49 times.

Eastcoast · 2/18/2018 11:22 pm

Tuxie400 wrote:
We need some kind of Katarina reveal, and I'm on board with it coming this season. But I think since everyone is thinking about Katarina again, the reveal we'll get is about Fire Night. Spader said some whacked out thing in a recent podcast about TBL evealing stuff when the audience has stopped asking questions about it.

I had the same thought when I heard him say that. We need something......

lara1 · 2/19/2018 11:16 am

It would be good if we could see the real KR through the real fire, and not just through people's memories (Liz imagining her, when she says she has no memory of her mother; Kate's recollections with her severe migraine inducing head injury) But I don't know if that's possible unless realtime KR shows up. I think it may be too soon for her to show up, but then again I could see it as a cliffhanger.

anyway I still think something is up, we get either a fire reveal or at least a KR in the fire reveal. Too much KR and fire imagery going on.....just IMO of course.

Last edited by lara1 (2/19/2018 11:17 am)

Tuxie400 · 2/19/2018 1:29 pm

In Ilyas Surkov, there's a scene at Nik's funeral with Red seen walking in front of a large cross. The cross is much taller but it is the same shape as the tombstone cross in the Drexel painting. I've posted the images here:
https://imgur.com/a/5p7xf

I think this is one of three images the showrunners have embedded to subliminally reinforce the top ideas on the identity of the suitcaset bones. Seeing Reddington in a graveyard next to a cross similar to one in a painting that suggested his death makes the viewer think the real Reddington might be in the suitcase.

The most recent of these subliminal images was in The Invisible Hand. Seeing a woman with long red hair buried and come out of a grave suggests the idea of Katarina Rostova as having been the suitcase body. Anna Hopkins with her age, hair and eye color all remind one of Katarina, as lara1 so keenly observed.
https://imgur.com/a/1EwYS

The third image is the one I've already posted of the sisters' tombstone and the rabbits in The Travel Agency. The third most prevalent notion of who's in the suitcase is a half sister to Liz, like Ballerina girl.

Last edited by Tuxie400 (2/19/2018 4:24 pm)

Tatiana · 2/19/2018 2:44 pm

Good observations, Tuxie. I had attributed all religious items as part of the good/evil theme, but you are far more specific and it makes me think then of the painting sent to Red: we know Liz killed her father the night of the fire, she says so when her memories are induced, and Red confirms it. The painting would confirm it too and thus that the bones in the suitcase belong to her real father, Raymond Reddington.

If Raymond Reddington, a counter intelligence spy who is so well regarded and on a super track career path, if he was killed, there would have been an investigation. And if there was an investigation, a lot of things would have been revealed about both the Russians and the Americans and our counter intelligensia.

They had to bury Raymond Reddington and they had to have 'Red' assume his identity. But who is Red? I don't know. Maybe if someone does find out that those are the real Raymond Reddington's bones, the truth about Faux Red, Fred, would also be revealed.

lara1 · 2/19/2018 4:18 pm

Tuxie400 #38 - thanks for that, I had somehow completely missed (or forgotten about) the image of Red in the graveyard with a very similar cross behind him. I am sure that was included intentionally in the angle of the camera shot.

The other possible twist to this was that "original" Red was Russian, turned by the US to counterspy and potentially trap Soviet agents. If that were the case, then if he were killed, especially in the rather wild scene around fire night (if that happened), a lot of things could have blown up, potentially exposing other US agents or Russian moles etc.

And one of the things that I think from time to time was that Red as Russian "mole" is possibly what is being hinted at by all the references to the ground, holes in the ground, tunnels and such. Its a stretch but that's what moles do (the rodent that is) - live underground and dig very long tunnels. But that might be too large a leap on the word "mole", LOL

I also think that if current Red is not original Red, and Dom knew, he would still call him Raymond. Just like Red calls him Dom (which may or may not be his original first name, I'm betting on no), if you assume an identity you are that person, even in private moments. After 30 years, you are certainly that other person. And who knows who may be listening anyway, even in a remote cabin in the woods.

Just what Kate's involvement in all of this was, if it was anything, is an open question. But she knew of Oleander, whether or not she knew who he really was. Which pulls the whole thing into the espionage realm, IMO. But who knows. But I think maybe the suitcase thing implodes a whole lot of things. Maybe.