Tatiana wrote:

Thanks Lara!!
interesting take on who's in the suitcase (that was really weird to write that!)
I was thinking about who calls RR what and I kept thinking that Fitch always called him Ray. I just kind of find that intersting.

 
The thing that always struck me about Fitch was that at the last, knowing he is about to die, he asks to see Ray. Not his wife. Not anyone close to him. But Reddington. To tell him about the safe in the apartment in St Petersburg, that leads him to Leonard Caul. That was more important to Fitch than saying goodbye to his wife or family. And on top of that, why be so worried about what Red would do with the Fulcrum when he obviously knew darned well that Red couldn't do anything with it without Leonard Caul to make it go? Which leads me back to my biggest question of the series (besides the presidential limo): what was Red's agreement with Fitch and why did he need one?

Wow! You folks have been busy! Excellent ideas!

I'm bringing over my one, small comment:

What if Naomi/Carla is Fitch's daughter? That makes Fitch Reddington's father-in-law.

I was thinking that being a relative may have been one reason that Fitch even discussed a deal with him. And that ties into the family theme.

Last edited by IowaWatcher (5/31/2017 5:04 pm)

Tuxie400 wrote:

lara1 - I don't know that Raymond was ever truly in love with Katarina - in lust perhaps. We did see him in that car with Kat in Requiem. And perhaps she was an addiction - the something dark he was drawn to like Liz was drawn to Tom. Kirk and Kaplan confirm Katarina broke off the relationship with Raymond, and when she did, he took Masha. He chose the child. By the time we get to Fire Night, I think he felt betrayed and set up by Katarina. And we know what Red does to people who betray him. That's why I'm willing to believe those bones in the suitcase could be Katarina's - if Red is the original Raymond. If he's really Katarina, I think the bones belong to Raymond Reddington.

Tuxie400 - those are more interesting thoughts.  I don't know, the more I think about it, the more I'm not that convinced that Red killed Katarina - not dismissing it though, its possible.  I don't know, I kind of think Cape May would have had a different feel to it, as would his interactions with Dom.  I tend to think Red was at Cape May, and maybe he was responsible for what happened there but not in a direct way.  (Failure to prevent her drowning; getting there too late, for example.).   I think Dom blames Red for "killing" his family but I wonder if he means that literally, or rather, because of steps Red took or didn't take.  And what Red "did to Katerina" could mean almost anything.....

The again, there is all that axe imagery - including in Cape May.  But that could probably relate to anyone or perhaps, just disposal of a body.  I'll note that Red is shown carrying an axe outside the hotel, when stalking the "intruder"; and when he goes to talk to Katarina, he kind of has it behind his back, almost like he was hiding it from her.  So did he kill someone else, and hide it from her?

And having said all of that, I still think its more likely that Katerina is in the suitcase than the other options.  At least today I do....

Last edited by lara1 (5/31/2017 6:39 pm)

lara1 wrote:

Honey West #22 - that is a good point that I keep forgetting!  Leonard Caul had the cipher, Red had only 2 parts out of the three needed.  Maybe it was a sort of detente - i.e., Red couldn't operate the fulcrum without Caul and vice versa.  But maybe the more "damaging" piece of it was the one that Red had - that had all of the info and perhaps the danger always was that Red could equally find someone to write a cipher for it, or maybe already had.  I don't know, I just thought of that as I was typing this.

Iowa Watcher #24 - yes that is interesting.  I always felt that Fitch and Red had some connection so that Fitch always looked out for Red, to the extent he could, when his hands weren't tied, sort to speak.  That would be one!  (Of course I don't believe that the Carla marriage was a full, real marriage, but if it was, and it very well may have been, your idea makes sense!)

And the thing is, that Fitch KNEW Red couldn't do anything with the Fulcrum without Caul. But he allowed Red to use it to hold off the Cabal for years. He knew Red was essentially bluffing all that time. I've always thought Fitch was Red's mentor, and I think Tabasko told me the comic book sort of pointed that way, but suppose it was even more than that. I really like Iowa's idea that he could have been Carla's dad. I hadn't thought of that!

Iowa Watcher and Honey West - I just thought about the dates.  They purposely give us the birthday for Fitch's wife and how long they were married.  I can't remember - was the date on Naomi's license 1964?  I think it was something like that, 64 or 65.  probably a fake date but it might be the right year.

Margaret, Fitch's wife, was born in 1944.  So she would have been 20 in 1964.  And Fitch said they were married 51 years.  So when we meet Naomi in 2014/15, probably, she would have been around 51 at that time.  And I'm guessing the Decembrist occurred around the same time in the timeline, so the 51 years married holds for Fitch, I think.

Intriguing!  Maybe we were given those dates from Fitch for a reason.....

Last edited by lara1 (5/31/2017 10:59 pm)

lara1 wrote:

Thanks Eastocoast for the screen shot!   I have actually seen yet another person, a child.  The pic you posted is of a person seated to the left of little Liz in the closet.  The other face I saw, was very faint, almost like a ghosty image, of another child, to her right, a second before it cuts to a completely different scene.  Wow, that was a busy closet!

I like the picture of the purse, as well.  I never noticed that detail!  So was there a woman living at the house, and who was she?  I have tried to figure out what else was in the closet, to no avail....men or women's clothing?    

I did another re-watch today....
I got a lot of shots of it but need time to crop etc... On one side of the closet it appears to be ladies clothes and the other side mens. Looks like mens tan shirt uniforms.
( I saw a plaid,lol) I got one of that just for you!!
So I guess a purse would not seam too unusual.
I got pics of those faces all running together too.
Yes, a busy closet! lol


 

Last edited by Eastcoast (6/01/2017 12:58 am)

After looking at Lord Baltimore I am inclined to think there was just some sort of accident or screw up as Dom would put it...

Hearing her say that she didn't say anything about him or Elizabeth after seeing what we have seen feels a bit different to me.
When she said to her, he is not who you think he is.... she could have well meant that he isn't just a guy helping you on cases. He is your father.

At the end Naomi says to him, 'you need to tell her'. If it was that bad of a thing I wouldn't think she would have used the soft caring tone that she did.

My new question right now is, about the person Liz shot. May not have been her dad. But either way wouldn't he have been in the house left behind for the firefighters to find after they put the fire out?
If so, then that person is not in the suitcase.

And, A little thing a friend mentioned is what if Tom found the envelope Liz threw out with the Dna results?
That could be why he said your father is alive?  

I agree with you, eastcoast #34. That's a valid interpretation of what Naomi may have meant. And the idea that Tom could have found the older DNA results that Liz threw away. I need to watch those episodes again because the timing is getting fuzzier the further away we get from them. I think Tom has known the truth for quite some time, but was sitting on it in case he needed a hole card for some reason. Or maybe he thought the truth would hurt Liz and after everything they've been through he just couldn't do that to her, and now with Agnes he wouldn't bring it up. But his "daddy's permission" comment to Red strikes me as him reminding Red that he knew the truth. Remember when Red gave Tom that envelope in the cafe and tried to get rid of him that way? I wonder if he might have also bought Tom's silence on that subject at that time.

Iowa Watcher - I like the idea that Carla is Fitch's daughter. Someone on Blacklist Support Group suggested this a long time ago.  Was it you? 

Honey West - It is interesting that the last person Fitch would want to speak with was Reddington. I never thought it might be because of familial ties. But Fitch implied Red knew his wife, Margaret, and told him the combination to the safe in St. Petersburg was her birthday.

lara1 - I think the timeline you lay out would allow Margaret to be Carla's mother. There was a discrepany on Carla's age. Along with the driver's license, there was some other FBI document that gave her birth year as 1966.

I've never felt Carla was a cover wife for Red. I believe she was really his wife, and she was still very angry because of his betrayal and stupidity. There was too much emotion on both sides, from Red's worry about her to the tender goodbye. I believe Carla was indeed the wife involved in the marriage counseling Red mentioned in The Director. Carla was Reddington's wife of record, and that's one of the reasons I believe Red is the original Raymond. I've also never bought the idea that Jennifer is a stepdaughter, although she may be. The FBI files said he was on his way home on furlough for Christmas to see his wife and daughter - not his stepdaughter.

Did Red tell the truth when he told Zoe D'Antonio, Berlin's daughter, that he had one daughter? If Liz is his daughter, that would mean Jennifer is not. If Jennifer is his bio daughter, then did he not know for sure if Liz was his child?  So many questions, so many daughters.

Honey West - yes, we must look for Tom eyeing something in the wastebasket between Ep 2 and when Liz shoots him.  (I am serious, LOL.  It will be fun to actually find something like that!). 

Tuxie400 - Yes, good point, there was a certain familiarity between Red and Fitch so that when Fitch spoke with Red, the things he said were understood between them.  Maybe a Naomi connection.  But if not, some other personal tie.     

I'm not sure any other show has said so much while giving so little information!  LOL